Lower LS defensive Stats!!

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
Why does it take 100 LS to clear a nuke?

Punish players for being bad at answering alarms and cut their defensive in half so one nuke can clear 8 nukes instead of 4!!!!!!!!

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bugeyes10

Phrourach
Imagine how brutal it would be to clear LS with morale and night bonus. Send a full LS nuke and go negative on another LS nuke. There's no reason their defense shouldn't be on par with Biremes attacks
 

NutsNBoltz

Strategos
@Hydna @Baudin Toolan @Phantom III since you all want to act like you understand the game, give me a good explanation as to why LS have such high defensive stats.
troy-laugh.gif
 

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
LS have rubbish defence mate, otherwise people wouldn't hunt them XD try sticking some boosts on if you aren't happy with what you're getting, or make bigger nukes?
what a weird take, a split 458 nuke, which I have MULTIPLE of, can only kill roughly 4.5 LS nukes.... There's no explanation as to why they'd have 6 defense/pop when biremes have 3 attack/pop

they should be at worst in line with each other to allow proper LS hunting. Where 50 kills an entire nuke instead of 100.

If we want to get into a practical application of this.



LS if there was ever a night bonus EN world would have 120 defense, or 12 defense/pop.

Then we can factor in 30% morale, aka multiplying their defense by 3.3.


You'd be able to stick LS nukes into a designated Low Morale city and have them function more proficiently defensively than Birs in a normal Frontline city.... at 48 defense/pop relative to biremes at 20 defense /pop


It's almost like the offensive ship should NEVER have a situation where it can be used defensively.


Even if we were to not take into account NB, on a morale world LS would have slightly higher defensive stats than biremes when stacked in a low morale city. Luck dependent? You could go NEGATIVE trying to clear LS on a morale world


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So again, why don't you reiterate how you know absolutely nothing about the balancing of the game and leave the actual TheoryCrafting to players who actually know how to do basic arithmetic beyond "haha LS bad defense why else do you hunt them"
 

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
And just for clarity's sake, if you were to bring LS defensive stats in line with the per population value of Bireme attack...

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LS will now still get bonked through minimum morale...
 

mwahahahaha

Hoplite
But morale is to give smaller players an advantage when attacked by bigger players, so if you have 10 cities and a LS nuke of 458 and a player with 1 city has 50 LS then morale is supposed to make it less advantageous for you to attack them. If we take away that then why bother having morale at all. Some worlds have it and some don't, also I'm not smart enough to work this out but if you had all research and spelled the LS attack on your normal world then it'd hit harder. Or there's all those bonus things now that give stronger attack, which are pretty easy to get from island quests. I can't comment on night bonus as I've never played it tbf.

Do you have a nuke of 458 LS? I've literally just re-joined after years away and haven't got a full LS nuke city streamed yet, whats the top amount you can get? Off topic but it's really bugging me **edit just seen u do have them, so is that the top amount then?
 

bugeyes10

Phrourach
Do you have a nuke of 458 LS? I've literally just re-joined after years away and haven't got a full LS nuke city streamed yet, whats the top amount you can get? Off topic but it's really bugging me
literally said "build bigger nukes" and doesn't know the max nuke size lol. but anyways that's off topic.

Back to the topic, the point which you're so gracefully ignoring is that LS are weak defensively, but not as weak as they should be. The math that @Back2Basics just did out for us shows that under the right circumstances LS are more efficient on defense than Birs. Granted those circumstances are extremely rare but it should never happen. The idea presented is that LS should be as weak defensively as birs are offensively. LS have twice the defensive value per pop when compared to Bir offensive value per pop. At the same time Birs have the same defense per pop as LS have attack per pop. The idea is that why not just give them the same stats just inverted for their use case. Having to send 100 LS to clear a nuke is absurd and the defense of LS should be lowered to fix this.
 

MasterSpy

Chiliarch
Why should 2 units balance each other's out. Arent you all forgetting that there are also tris, hydra, fs and now sirens to put into play here also. Not the mention defensive heros, tokens etc. The biggest thing you are all forgetting though is that the resource and pop cost of the 2 units in question (ls and birs) is different so their att and def values should also be different. If every unit had an exact opposite in values then we would only need very few unit types and strategy etc would go out the window. Think about it before you comment and complain in future.
 

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
Why should 2 units balance each other's out. Arent you all forgetting that there are also tris, hydra, fs and now sirens to put into play here also. Not the mention defensive heros, tokens etc. The biggest thing you are all forgetting though is that the resource and pop cost of the 2 units in question (ls and birs) is different so their att and def values should also be different. If every unit had an exact opposite in values then we would only need very few unit types and strategy etc would go out the window. Think about it before you comment and complain in future.
alternatively, you can get over your own ego and accept LS shouldn't under any circumstance be defensively viable, you goof.
 
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mwahahahaha

Hoplite
That's not an answer really to the streaming thing but nvm. I can tell you all the streams and amount of LS u could fit in a city on the original worlds, I can also say the average LS nuke was 300 but people had quite a bit more than that in a full streamed city. I'm not a maths whizz mate, there's a LOT different from when I played, sorry for asking a question :p I'll work it out when my cities are sorted.

Ok so those LS are more efficient as defence than biremes? NO, same world settings, players and same amount of biremes instead of LS and the biremes (or even better work it out as defence per pop) have more defence, right? because the smaller player gets the same bonus for all units?

Basically you want your LS to kill more than double the amount of LS than what they're killing now. Also as said above the ships are not the exact opposite of each other so why should their attack and defence values match. You're still killing 4x the amount of LS you have if u can kill 4 nukes with one.
 

MasterSpy

Chiliarch
alternatively, you can get over your own ego and accept LS shouldn't under any circumstance be offensively viable, you goof.
maybe you should realise that you obviously dont understand anything about unit ratios and game tactics. it's not just who has the biggest and most nukes. every units can be used in the correct way if you know how. even birs can be used offensively.
 

Hydna

Grepolis Team
@Hydna @Baudin Toolan @Phantom III since you all want to act like you understand the game, give me a good explanation as to why LS have such high defensive stats.
This is a strategy game. You have a variety of units all with different strengths and the aim is to use them in combination to best advantage. It is not about one unit and why that may have a better or worse defence than another. If you think ls have such a great defence then I'm sure your enemies will be happy if you pop them in all your cities and go to sleep!
 

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
This is a strategy game. You have a variety of units all with different strengths and the aim is to use them in combination to best advantage. It is not about one unit and why that may have a better or worse defence than another. If you think ls have such a great defence then I'm sure your enemies will be happy if you pop them in all your cities and go to sleep!
not if i have one of my friends drop an alt account, then my 3K LS wall is stronger than a 3k Bir wall

you know, the math you elected to ignore above proving that you don't even understand how your own mechanics work....
 

NutsNBoltz

Strategos
not if i have one of my friends drop an alt account, then my 3K LS wall is stronger than a 3k Bir wall

you know, the math you elected to ignore above proving that you don't even understand how your own mechanics work....

math is pretty simple, biremes offer 20 defense per pop, LS offer 6 per pop. Perhaps we can get back to basics, but math. Here's something your speed

 

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
math is pretty simple, biremes offer 20 defense per pop, LS offer 6 per pop. Perhaps we can get back to basics, but math. Here's something your speed


until you stick them in a LMD city, in which situation means LS have EXACTLY the same defense as Birs...

Essentially, going pure LS on a morale world with somewhere to hide them at night is the same as just having a massive Bir wall
 

MasterSpy

Chiliarch
until you stick them in a LMD city, in which situation means LS have EXACTLY the same defense as Birs...

Essentially, going pure LS on a morale world with somewhere to hide them at night is the same as just having a massive Bir wall
you jsut answered your own question without even knowing it. The defensice value of the LS wall will only be the same as the bir wall if the LS player is low moral...hence the word 'strategy'. sacrifice a players size to protect big players troops, wow, fancy doing that.

You're already so far behind in your reasoning and argument here that you'd be best either quitting now or even better, request this thread be deleted to avoid it being used against you in the future...it just displays compete ignorance and incompetence in the game. Like your name says, get back to basics before you try to compete with the big boys and girls.
 

Back2Basics

Chiliarch
you jsut answered your own question without even knowing it. The defensice value of the LS wall will only be the same as the bir wall if the LS player is low moral...hence the word 'strategy'. sacrifice a players size to protect big players troops, wow, fancy doing that.

You're already so far behind in your reasoning and argument here that you'd be best either quitting now or even better, request this thread be deleted to avoid it being used against you in the future...it just displays compete ignorance and incompetence in the game. Like your name says, get back to basics before you try to compete with the big boys and girls.
sounds like someone doesn't use alarms and doesn't want their LS to be cleared....

you don't need to sacrifice anything to drop an alt account designated purely to hiding troops at night... hell, you could load up a VPN and drop yourself an account in under 5 minutes for all it's worth.

Ironically, the "big boys and girls" happen to be the alliance I lead. You know, the one who's won both of the last two worlds it's dropped, including a recent wonders world where we dropped 2 months late and still took 4/7?

Alarmless players shouldn't be rewarded with LS having an uncharacteristically high defense stat relative to every other specialized unit in the game, making them painful to hunt in large quantities.

If you can't see that, you probably should've licked less windows as a child.
 
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