- For the attention of Snake -

chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
Aren't we past world #428 now?
You may have a point though. Personally I am not a fan of the WW. Been through it twice already. It kills activity, and the reward for going into the Hero World really isn't worth the effort - though I do agree it shouldn't be a big reward, as it would just tip the balance even more between players.

I guess as an alliance that means we'll lose a few people when the WW starts, and they want to be part of it. I suspect we'll gain more than enough players in return who want to just keep doing what a war game should be about. Also, part of the fun will be trying to break into a Wonder Island to mess someone's plans up!
Pretty sure we are on world #4280 and fryn just lost the 0 of the end. ;)

I reckon Pella will struggle to get to WW at this rate, but eventually it will come and then alot of alliances will lose alot of players. Its not a test of skill, just a test of resilience to boredom I guess. :D
 

Leonidas Agiad

Guest
Originally Posted by Leonidas Agiad
7 Its absurd to say MOS are only a "technical #1", as if that should excuse you from being the target of all other Pella alliances !
Dont remember trying to use it as an excuse to not get attacked. So youre twisting my words. ~ chrisg2003bt
OK Chris, so why ARE you saying MOS are only a "technical #1" !? Its fairly obvious to just about everybody else in Pella that MOS are clearly in the #1 position, and its no technicality !?
 
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chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
If i may quote myself..

rather than assuming they have no brain to think for themselves and that MOS is some kind of ruler over them. We may be in the technical #1 spot, but thats only in points.
I was pointing out that just because we are number 1, doesnt mean that we are some kind of ruler over our allies as you all are suggesting.

I assumed that was fairly obvious, given the context surrounding when I said it. Apologies that it was not.
 

Leonidas Agiad

Guest
OK, thats fair enough, I accept your assertion that you aren't imposing these pacts on your allies. We have then established that:

1. MOS are in a real position of top rank
2. Normally, this would mean MOS would be the target of any other leading alliances who wanted to win
3. In Pella, we have the extremely unusual situation that the 2nd and 3rd ranked alliances are Pacted with the 1st ranked alliance, meaning they are trying to help MOS win Pella, instead of seeking victory for themselves
4. These Pacts appear to be based on personal friendships between alliance leaders, instead of the interests of their members, who are expected to invest their time and money for no chance of victory

I can see why MOS are pleased with this unusual situation, but surely you can equally see why some members of the 2nd and 3rd ranked alliances might feel betrayed by these Pacts, as they sacrifice their chance of victory. If it was discovered in any sporting league that the managers of the 2nd and 3rd placed teams were working to help the 1st placed team win the league, then there would be a riot amongst the fans and players of those teams !!! (and probably a corruption investigation too !).
 
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chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
Youre leaving out the possibility of any kind of merge in the future.

Its no secret that all of the top alliances, in fact all of the top 10 no doubt, have inactives in their alliance.

This would free up valuable slots and increase the chances of any merge or disband.

There is no "betrayal". Even when I said the top members of each alliance, I didnt mean just the alliance leaders. A top member could be even the lowest of the low points player, but whos got the activity level and is willing to make themselves known. Hard to be friends with everyone in an alliance, especially with language barriers and/or less active players.

If i could talk and make conversation with them all then I would. I talk to enough people from each alliance to consider alot of them friends, yes.

Also.. Not once did I say it was the ONLY reason we have pacts either. :)

Although this conversation appears to be going round in circles. My main point is, we have the pacts, they arent going anywhere just because our enemies say they should.

------

Im trying to have a more fun time and tone down the serious political stuff btw.. It doesnt make the game anymore fun for me. ;) But i will try and answer if its a genuine question, and not too hotheaded. :)

Chris
 
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Leonidas Agiad

Guest
LoL, well I'm sure we will see numerous mergers before Pella is done.
Maybe MOS should consider merging into somebody else given how high your inactivity level is ! (the highest of any top 10 alliance, members considered inactive in the table below if grepostats is zero or less points every day for last week)



Theres any number of other permutations that would make sense ... hey a TDK/TSL merger would give MOS a run for its money !
:p
 
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chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
Inactivity includes VM however. So for an accurate comparison you should probably remove the people in VM mode.

Not that you know who exactly they are, nor, im sure, can you be bothered to go through the list and figure it out for yourself. :)

Unless youre really that attentive to detail..

----

I would add that supposedly GGW/PFK and DOOM are giving MOS a run for its money already? Unless you wish to change that statement which im sure has been mentioned more than once by several of the members in those 3 alliances. :)

According to your own stats, thats 107 active members of 3 alliances.. vs 56 active members of MOS.

TSL arent really fighting any of your 3 so cant really be included on MOS' side. TDK could be added I suppose as they are currently fighting in a minority of 56 cities against GGW. Its all debatable and can be flipped and argued in multiple ways.

You could then include OFTR in the equation and therefore add TSL. Or.. well i dunno. Go wild. :)
 
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bend24

Guest
Wow the inactivity list really makes PfK look even more impressive in my opinion. Obviously I am biased because its my former alliance, but they are doing very well against MOS with more or less only 25 active players. Out of those 25 active I would guess that 5-10 are fairly small players still and are more or less just supporters than big hitters.

Obviously there is other alliances fighting along with PfK against MOS, but still I think its rather impressive. OfTR and DOOM both have very very good activity levels, props to them, its hard to keep people interested and active sometimes in the later parts of the game.
 

frynturn

Guest
3. In Pella, we have the extremely unusual situation that the 2nd and 3rd ranked alliances are Pacted with the 1st ranked alliance
nothing unusual about this.

When did you join this world because it sounds like you have joined late and then slept through the Chronicles of Pella late night documentary that Chris screens every night before he goes to bed (although to be fair he does skip over a lot of the non-MOS stuff).

TDK/TSL never used to be 2nd/3rd alliances so should any pacts just be dropped because an alliance hits a certain number of points? Does this only apply to the #1 alliance or does it work its way down the ladder too? Can TSL pact with TDK for instance or does there need to be 6 degrees of separation? If someone knocks MOS out of the #1 spot can TSL pact with them again, assuming of course that TSL isn't number 1 because that would be same same but different.

Please enlighten me on the rules that should be followed. In the meantime I'm going to go off and figure out what my chances of wining the lottery is if I only choose non-consecutive numbers.
 

chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
Adding onto frynturns post. The only way i know of to track people's position in the rankings throughout time is the top 12 thread. (+rep to bend).

So.. tracking through the history of the top 12 alliances thread.


TSL's Position in Rankings when MOS pact began.

http://forum.en.grepolis.com/showthread.php?36909-Alliances/page7

TDK's (aka KOA (pre-name change)) Position in Rankings when MOS pact began.

http://forum.en.grepolis.com/showthread.php?36909-Alliances/page12

For those who are like me and too lazy to click.. Thats 10th for TSL and 9th for KOA (TDK). :cool:
 
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Leonidas Agiad

Guest
Well, frynturn, your Pact strategy would depend on whether you have any ambition to Win or not ?
 

SirNippleberry

Phrourach
In response to chris and fryguy's posts, I have no quarrels with TSL or TDK for their pacts with MOS. They have been allies for a while now, and long term allies won't turn on each other until we get close to WW. Plus, TSL knows that whenever they get in a sticky situation MOS will bail them out ;).

Also, I'm kind of wondering why the smaller alliances on the server like Pirates of Pella, and Reapers are helping out MOS and friends... what is their endgame?

p.s. Has anybody bothered looking at the conquest records of the Legends or Barbarians? Looks like everyone else in the top 10 is picking on these two alliances whenever they need spare cities lol.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
Youre leaving out the possibility of any kind of merge in the future.

Its no secret that all of the top alliances, in fact all of the top 10 no doubt, have inactives in their alliance.

This would free up valuable slots and increase the chances of any merge or disband.

There is no "betrayal". Even when I said the top members of each alliance, I didnt mean just the alliance leaders. A top member could be even the lowest of the low points player, but whos got the activity level and is willing to make themselves known. Hard to be friends with everyone in an alliance, especially with language barriers and/or less active players.

If i could talk and make conversation with them all then I would. I talk to enough people from each alliance to consider alot of them friends, yes.

Also.. Not once did I say it was the ONLY reason we have pacts either. :)

Although this conversation appears to be going round in circles. My main point is, we have the pacts, they arent going anywhere just because our enemies say they should.

------

Im trying to have a more fun time and tone down the serious political stuff btw.. It doesnt make the game anymore fun for me. ;) But i will try and answer if its a genuine question, and not too hotheaded. :)

Chris


A merge would mean major culling of members....and what merge? MOS, TDK & TSL? Alliance limit of 80 players....many will be left in the cold, especially seeing the high numbers MOS & TDK already have.

You suggesting that you are using the pacts for other reasons, like say, to save MOS the problem of working too hard in holding the #1 rank? Is that using your pacts for strategical purposes and ultimately drop them when the time is right and MOS feels like it? Brings back BOM memories here.
 

chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
You're still acting as if a merge was to happen now. I'm merely stating that you are leaving no room for this possibility.

If a merge was going to happen, surely it would happen at a time that was right and fair? As all merges should.

@Nipple - Glad to see someone a little more understanding of the pacts. I think (and hope) the ranks at the start of the merge and fryn's comments has put the issue to bed now. Hahaa.

As for the comment about reapers and pop, if a pact is mutually beneficial to both parties, then surely it makes sense. The enemy of my enemy is my friend and all that nonsense.

We hold no official pact with Reapers though, to my knowledge there is a certain amount of help between old friends. Romes can answer for himself. :)
 

frynturn

Guest
of course an 80 member alliance with all active players sending 3 times a day would cream the WW stage :)
 

Leonidas Agiad

Guest
A compact territory is vital to that equation too, frynturn. As you can see from the map below, MOS have an elongated territorial footprint, with few secured edges, spanning 3-4 oceans, so potential Wonder locations aren't ideal (maybe NE location, o64, once TSL members merge into MOS), and resource transportation is slower.

TDK by comparison have a 'natural' Wonder zone in o36, with secure frontiers, and the majority of their alliance within just 1 ocean away, so resource delivery would be quicker on average than MOS's, eg. 3x a day for TDK, compared to maybe 2x a day for MOS. Given TDK are on 1700 cities (x3 = 5100 deliveries), and MOS are on 2470 cities (x2 = 4940 deliveries), you could reasonably argue TDK have a better Wonder Winning territory than MOS.
 
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snake223

Guest
Everyone who is arguing this point uses this in their argument in different ways, so say "Ahh they are so high in points, of course you will win" some say, "Even though they are so high in points we are winning", or..

"Points mean nothing, MOS has high points and they are rubbish". or the opposite "MOS has so many points you should have no pacts and fight everyone". Just using and turning the argument around in endless

Only thing I think MOS does too much is hit the speed up button they done it from day one to the present day

Dave Y - Chris don't need button up TDK/TSL for simple reason the leaders will make a little note in forum a febal attempt to show their alliance they trying to win the server but all in all when the lead alliance is near there (if it MOS) then they will get an invite at the death of server.

Chris will try spin this but we all know even if we don't want admit it this will happen.

Remember this we have 2 choices

1. We try win the race to the WW

2. We attack, they will be pumping 95% resources into the WW afterall and be real weak
 
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Dave Y

Phrourach
True enough, like I originally said: you either are in it for your alliance to win, or not. Or on the other side, to prevent any alliance from winning at all. There is no prize for second place or setting the number 1 alliance up to win. Pacted alliances can't send to another alliances WW's and sure won't get any credit for being their human shields either. Looks like a smoke screen to me.
 

chrisg2003bt

Phrourach
You guys should really stop talking about the wonders like its going to happen in a few weeks time.

Alot can change between now and 10months time.

Personally I still think Gaulius and his Pirate paratroopers are a the ones to watch for the wonders win. :pro: