Inactive Topic Game Variant - The Art of War

DeletedUser

Guest
I suggested something like this a while ago, a game variant of grepo for speed worlds where you try and start out of the core and conquer inwards until you get to a golden island that you and your alliance have to hold. And you have to have all your pacts shown, have a small member cap, etc.

Since this is similar to my old idea, I like it, and I think it should be implemented eventually, but only for a speed world.
 

DeletedUser13936

Guest
I wish there was another speed world :( i never got to participate in the first one.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I love this idea. But here are some flaws I noticed from participating in a similar event on Tribalwars.

If the alliance you join is dependant on the direction you start in... Then who is the leader of said alliance? You will need a leader to organize things. A random leader would be disasterous and an elected one will mean more work for the IG Staff to organize it all.

Another thing is, if alliances are fixed then you won't be able to kick players or inactives... If someone joins this world and all his friends are in one direction and hes in another, then its possible that he will try and help his friends more then his alliance. In other words, how do you stop spies?
Leaders will also be unable to stop selfish players, or even to stop people from taking over alliance members...
But you can't give leaders the power to kick

And of course... during the first few months a lot of people will drop out, and the alliances will have no way to replenish those losses, a lot of people will be unhappy with how things are progressing, but are helpless to change their situation. So they quit.

Anyways, if this were to ever happen you would need a lot of support from the ingame staff + you would really need to think this out more.

I'm not trying to break down this idea, because I think its wonderful, but it does need more work.
^^
 

DeletedUser13459

Guest
i like this idea. and i would play in the server should it happen..
 

DeletedUser17088

Guest
I love this idea. But here are some flaws I noticed from participating in a similar event on Tribalwars.

If the alliance you join is dependant on the direction you start in... Then who is the leader of said alliance? You will need a leader to organize things. A random leader would be disasterous and an elected one will mean more work for the IG Staff to organize it all.

Another thing is, if alliances are fixed then you won't be able to kick players or inactives... If someone joins this world and all his friends are in one direction and hes in another, then its possible that he will try and help his friends more then his alliance. In other words, how do you stop spies?
Leaders will also be unable to stop selfish players, or even to stop people from taking over alliance members...
But you can't give leaders the power to kick

And of course... during the first few months a lot of people will drop out, and the alliances will have no way to replenish those losses, a lot of people will be unhappy with how things are progressing, but are helpless to change their situation. So they quit.

Anyways, if this were to ever happen you would need a lot of support from the ingame staff + you would really need to think this out more.

I'm not trying to break down this idea, because I think its wonderful, but it does need more work.
^^


all of the above 'problems' should be overcome with your skill, common sense and maturity

The mods would never take part in an election of a leader, it is not a support issue (not the same as 'missing founder')

no where in the original post does it say 'alliances are fixed', People always drop out in first few months and your invention that alliances are fixed means this is not a problem. Your confusing the term 'team' with 'alliance' and you would be able to form an alliance within your direction if you wanted to easily and conquer others on your 'team'

This is all dependant upon who is the most successful in a 'direction' and then who is the most successful direction.
 
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DeletedUser

Guest
I like the idea but I think it may need a bit of thought on some of the things Music Loving Chemist said,
Also I'd like to point out...
What happens if you are right at the outside point of the star?
This would mean you cant go for a direct route to the core oceans.
This would not be the case if there were 150 cities per unit/direction . (very small world)
Just a thought...
 

DeletedUser17088

Guest
I like the idea but I think it may need a bit of thought on some of the things Music Loving Chemist said,
Also I'd like to point out...
What happens if you are right at the outside point of the star?
This would mean you cant go for a direct route to the core oceans.
This would not be the case if there were 150 cities per unit/direction . (very small world)
Just a thought...

you can conquer players within your direction so your placement within the direction wouldn't matter much
 

DeletedUser345

Guest
TAOW.gif

Its good except white and black have a disadvantage over the other colours who already have footholds in the core oceans and can take that one. Black and white don't have this foothold in the core ocean and have to take two core oceans at a time instead of one...
 

DeletedUser18366

Guest
I don't get it but for all that I can understand is good. Seems quite scary for noobs like me :D FOTNS like it so much he doesn't care about the format!
 

DeletedUser12512

Guest
lol someone de-repped me for this idea....and of course didn't sign it.

There were a few questions raised, so I will pose potential solutions or responses to them, but again, I just start the idea, the community builds it so I expect that my answers won't always be the only answers, just one potential one.

Q1. If the alliance you join is dependant on the direction you start in... Then who is the leader of said alliance? You will need a leader to organize things. A random leader would be disasterous and an elected one will mean more work...

A1. It would not be any more work then it is to start on a server without being part of a pre-made, we do it all the time, A leader will rise - possibly several, and there may be infighting before one gets selected, or the 'point' may determine very early that it's in their best interest to work as one as fast as possible, the strategy will be up to the collective group. Whether your 'point' determines your alliance, or just your color is debatable, my initial reaction would be just your color. There would be no restriction on conquering a player of your wown color, however if their were server milestones added, it's likely the team tha twent after oppoosing colors first would get some of the new milestones added specifically for a server of this type)

Q2. If alliances are fixed then you won't be able to kick players or inactives... If someone joins this world and all his friends are in one direction and hes in another, then its possible that he will try and help his friends more then his alliance. In other words, how do you stop spies?

A2. Good question. You have a color, it determines your team, but not your alliane, there are no shared forums, so you would only be in a forum wiht your alliance, a spy would be no more of apain then he is currently, since its possible to have an alliance cap of 1000 you could have all the team colors in one alliance, or the 20 or so people you trust working towards a common goal as the rest of your team color.

Q3. Leaders will also be unable to stop selfish players, or even to stop people from taking over alliance members... But you can't give leaders the power to kick

A3. Leaders would stop selfish players the same way they do now, rim them. (which = removal from the server or reset to a different point to replenish players lost due to various other reasons if they shose ot restart, (up for debate and fine tuning obviously) And yes, leaders can of course be given the ability to kick a player they don't want in their alliance, just not from their color.

Q4. And of course... during the first few months a lot of people will drop out, and the alliances will have no way to replenish those losses, a lot of people will be unhappy with how things are progressing, but are helpless to change their situation. So they quit.

A4. Replenish losses? do you have any way to replenish losses now? People could continue to join the server, as I said there is a pop limit of 6k, so if some leave, otheres can join. Just randomly. The key point to all this though ,is that by the time people would be unhappy with how things are going, or unable to compete, they are either thinking of teaming up with another color to dominate the number one position (albeit with limited ability to communicate as there would be no merges and no shared forums - similar to how two countries had to work together before communication advancements) or (and more importantly) the end game of the server is about to be reached.

Q5. What happens if you are right at the outside point of the star?
This would mean you cant go for a direct route to the core oceans.
This would not be the case if there were 150 cities per unit/direction .

A5. It is a very small world, and if you happened to be on the outside of the point, my initial reaction would be that it is only 48 hours to a point in the core by CS, so there is no problem, or perhaps the 48 hour limit is raised to 60? Either way that problem seems minor and easily remedied with some testing.

Q6. white and black have a disadvantage over the other colours who already have footholds in the core oceans and can take that one. Black and white don't have this foothold in the core ocean and have to take two core oceans at a time instead of one...

A7. Are you certain this is a disadvantage? Is your entire team of 1000 potential alliance mates all going to go for the same core ocean at the same time? or could you have 2 squads? Is having one core in front of you better than having 2 and dominating the border? I don;t think you know the answer to that as I can see different advantages for both, and a variable style of play depending on the starting position.

Just my thoughts on the questions raised, others may have differnt ones, and as I said, thats ok, the main goal is simple, a small map with an end game and a clear 'winner' be it your alliance, or your color/team
 

DeletedUser809

Guest
1. Maps - you could easily have any number of different micromaps so I think it's probably not worth debating which way to set it up. Each new micromap server could use a different map to keep things fresh but I think the basic idea of a core ocean or set of oceans with colored starting areas surrounding is the key element.

2. Winning Conditions - as with Maps winning conditions could vary from one server to the next. The key being that only one alliance from one color can win.

3. Teams/Alliances/Colors - I think there are two important rules you need for this to work. First of all players should only be able to join an alliance made up of players from within their color. I assume this was your meaning but since I couldn't find it stated anywhere I just wanted to clarify. Spying would be a lot less interesting this way since the spy will never get any recognition that they were part of the winning team. They will be counted as part of a losing color if they successfully manage to damage the efforts of their team in support of friends in another color. Secondly, I think it would make sense to have a protection period at the beginning (maybe a month at speed 2) where players can only either conquer other players within their own color or colonize in the central ocean.

4. Just a point of clarification. You're saying that the core oceans would only have anchor points to start? So only colonization would be possible? Perhaps they could bump up the starting size of a colonized polis to speed things up a bit.
 

DeletedUser12512

Guest
all good points gadzooks and to your point 3 yes, that was what i had in mind
 

DeletedUser

Guest
moved to development . . . its a solid idea and i think its gotten realle good feedback (just finished re-reading each post).
 

DeletedUser

Guest
If this works it would be insane. Great idea and good work Atticus X!
 

DeletedUser19554

Guest
I love this idea but is it possible that....

1.it could be a higher speed so that's more competetive and requires more skill.


2.that there be many different stars so the world isn't so small and there can be regular amount or just a tad less players in the world but just in different sub sections.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
It is not often that I see an idea in these forums that I like. They are usually "make Grepolis just like another game which I quit because I didn't like it". This one is different (even if it looks like chinese checkers :p ).

The changes are a bit too dramatic to make it a regular server, but ideally suited to a round based special server. With this in mind, I have a few suggestions.

Cut down the size of the teams. 100 members per team is enough and will allow the speed to be ramped up. 600 players on a server will allow for close to 10 speed.

Make it a premium entry server with free administrator. With the admission price close to what players would normally spend on an administrator. This will reduce the number of players that aren't serious about playing.

Placement should be random to give everyone an equal chance. The colour of the team a player lands on will determine which alliance they are in. They either work together or lose.

To deal with players quitting or going inactive, the mods could maintain a waiting list of players to be allocated inactive places. Once again this will be 'luck of the draw' since only the mods will know who is at the top of their list.

Each team starts on a row of 5 islands on the perimeter of the core. Behind them is rows of 4, 3, 2 and 1 islands reserved for those that have been rimmed. The 10 island 'rim' gives each team 200 restart points. If all of those have been used, any rimmed player will not be able to restart. The core will contain islands with anchor points ready to be colonised.

These five starting islands will be the team's home base. If any one alliance was to capture all 5 islands, that team will be eliminated and their cities ghosted.

Any team that holds every spot on 16 of the starting island for a predetermined amount of time will be declared the winner and the game ends.
 
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