Passed Improvement: Aid for "Colour-Blind Players"

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DeletedUser

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Probably not a popular response but I don't think this is that good an idea. How much time does it save you if the alternative is manually changing the color of an aliance? 5 seconds?

How often do aliances change staus? Not very often.

A facility to choose our own color schemes might be useful. Like the color selector except applied to enemies, allies etc.

Sorry if this offends anyone, none intended.

so it's a no from me.
 

DeletedUser5819

Guest
You seem to be missing a stage here.
You don't just have to change the colour, you have to know that you have to change the colour. For that you need to check your alliance diplomacy. Easy enough once, but how will you know when you have to check it again? Every time you log on? Before each attack?
Diplomacy does change overnight sometimes. Not daily or even weekly, but when it does, it is important. That's why we have it shown on the map.
I don't see how it can be a no. What harm can it do (none at all) vs what good can it do (make the game playable for more customers). It would be foolish not to implement from a marketing perspective, as it should affect how many players stay because of ease of play and also how many players turn up because of a good reputation.

It probably takes about as long to change the colours of one alliance as it does to lift a wheelchair up 3 steps at a shopfront, but there is more to both situations.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I don't really want to get into a discussion (probably end up an argument) about it because I don't agree with the angle this is being pushed from. Colour blindness is not the same as having to use a wheelchair. It may well be inconvenient on occasion (in the game, different thing in RL before anyone wades in lol) but that is it.
 

DeletedUser5819

Guest
Whilst I disagree that "that's it" it was merely an example.

Being in a wheelchair probs doesn't affect grepoplay but it can affect getting into shops if they don't have a navigable entrance. There are laws about that sort of thing, and also social pressure is exerted.
Being colourblind adversely affects grepoplay. It is really undeniable at this point in the discussion. Someone in the know has suggested something that should fix the issue to a large extent without any loss of anything for other players.

Stuff that is "inconvenient but thats it" would include most bugs in gameplay, also lag, design faults around things being covered by other things. All of these are things which rightly inno works to fix when they are brought to attention. Excluding this one with frankly no reason given would be rather strange.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
ok, let's agree to disagree. We just have a different viewpoint that's all. Just so you know tho, I'm colour blind myself and I get by fine but then I set my own colours anyway regardless of alliance pacts/wars.

"would include most bugs in gameplay, also lag, design faults around things being covered by other things. All of these are things which rightly inno works to fix when they are brought to attention. Excluding this one with frankly no reason given would be rather strange. "

I'll comment on that comment tho :). I'm still encountering bugs that were about when I started playing almost 3 years ago. In fact there are more bugs now than when I started. Several of these have cost me gold on more than a few occasions. Even now, I move to a city, set a build queue and then find out I'm looking at details for the wrong city. The recruitment dialog doesn't work properly in a few ways, barracks aren't updated when pop growth is cast, I've a big list if you really want it lol. I have to refresh several times an hour just to play the game and use premium features I've paid for. So Whilst Inno may fix a few bugs here and there each update brings with it a raft of new bugs and old bugs that aren't quite fixed. Maybe they are unfixable without a redesign.

And I think fixing bugs, certainly in premium features, is pretty important. The more that's added the harder it will be to fix things that are broken.
 

DeletedUser5819

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I know the list of bugs, and yes of course each new update brings new ones, that is in the nature of updating a browser game. New problems also appear when each browser is updated. You would (honestly) be amazed how many bugs do get fixed, and how many of those you complain of have been fixed and either are back or something similar is back because the environment constantly changes. None of which is a reason not to fix one that doesn't bother you personally but does bother others. As I said way back, I am not colourblind but would find it useful. For others it would be more than useful. Lets take their own word for that rather than suggesting they are overegging it because our perspective may be different from theirs. Also worth noting is that those for whom it is a gamebreaker will not even be here to comment.

There are places to report the bugs you have mentioned and this is not it. They get confirmed, reported to the dev team, prioritised and fixed. This is a different place.

More will be added and changed, including stuff that isn't broken. Denying this won't change that either.

Still nothing you have said is in any way a reason not to implement this change. "I am colourblind and I get by" really doesn't cut it.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
"I know the list of bugs, and yes of course each new update brings new ones, that is in the nature of updating a browser game. "

I'm a professional developer of almost 30 years and been developing websites and application since the mid 90s. I'm not talking your hobbyist stuff here, I own a software development company. Believe me I know about development. What you're describing isn't the nature of updating browser games it's the nature of a broken design. Fix one thing, break another, fix that break something else or the thing you just fixed. Seriously you are talking to a an experienced devloper here so I know this "update are the problem", is a straw man.

But you're kinda going off the subject then asking me not to comment, putting words in my mouth. I'm not reporting bugs, I'm not complaining about bugs, you mentioned bugs. I'm merely making my point of view clear. I don't think this is necessary. Simple as that really.
 

DeletedUser5819

Guest
I didn't ask you not to comment, I said that the best reason you have come up with for not doing it is that it isn't a problem for you, and a description that it simply isn't much of a problem. Given the number of people who have stated it is a problem for them, that's not much of a reason.
Your other reason that you think if stuff is changed there will be more bugs so this shouldn't be changed, well stuff's gonna be changed.
I didn't say anything about you shouldn't comment, though for someone who doesn't want a discussion you certainly say a lot :p

Its amazing how many people on this forum are professional developers and own their own software company, and equally amazing how many different opinions they hold and how vehemently they hold them. I didn't say you shouldn't comment, and I doubt you would stop if I did, but your job is hugely off topic.

On topic, it is clear that you are comfortable with the workaround you use for this problem, whereas many others are not. I am sure there is something that could be done that would help everyone else without you having to change what you do ;)
 
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DeletedUser

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Guy commenting on color blindness. Try being colorblind first then come talk to me. I am not comparing it to being handicapped or more severe disabilities, but depending on the severity of ones colorblindness it can make somethings difficult and challenging.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I do say alot lol but "but your job is hugely off topic." is incorrect. Part of development is ensuring websites and applications comply with Accessibility recommendations for users with impairments, so I understand better than many the implications and benefits of a change like this. The ability to change colours is already there, just without categories for enemies/allies.

You cannot have a "one size fits all" approach to accessibility. In this case people see different colours depending on the type of colour blindness they have. Is Inno expected to provide a colour scheme for every variation or just the most common? If the latter what about people, still colour blind, who do not gain any benefit and still have to set their colours manually? They are still customers.

A much better solution, imho, is to provide a means to quickly apply a (possibly predefined by the individual) colour scheme to an entity in grepolis. The admin features in grepolis are very limited and cumbersome. If they were improved to a reasonable standard, requests such as this wouldn't be necessary. That's why I say fix what is there already before spending time developing features that should be easily accessible anyway.
 

DeletedUser38224

Guest
I do say alot lol but "but your job is hugely off topic." is incorrect. Part of development is ensuring websites and applications comply with Accessibility recommendations for users with impairments, so I understand better than many the implications and benefits of a change like this. The ability to change colours is already there, just without categories for enemies/allies.

You cannot have a "one size fits all" approach to accessibility. In this case people see different colours depending on the type of colour blindness they have. Is Inno expected to provide a colour scheme for every variation or just the most common? If the latter what about people, still colour blind, who do not gain any benefit and still have to set their colours manually? They are still customers.

A much better solution, imho, is to provide a means to quickly apply a (possibly predefined by the individual) colour scheme to an entity in grepolis. The admin features in grepolis are very limited and cumbersome. If they were improved to a reasonable standard, requests such as this wouldn't be necessary. That's why I say fix what is there already before spending time developing features that should be easily accessible anyway.

Stop saying that you can manually set colors for alliances. You can do this, But for heavens sake, That's the point of this suggestion. If you unpact with your ally, You have to change the color again. That's what this suggestion is, To make playing as a colorblind player less work.

There's also the issue of the alliance rights as mentioned in the OP, which there is no option to change the color of.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
All I'm saying is that it is near impossible to select a colour scheme that will be suitable for all colour blind users. So provide the ability to create custom colour schemes. When an alliance status changes, your custom colour scheme is applied. The same could be used to style any UI element. There's several ways it can be done, I'll give you examples if you want. But I suggest that the onus should be on the player to create the schemes with Inno providing the capability to do so.

Depraved jokes in the OP about Inno doing the research to find the best colours, but that's what they'd have to do. Far better to let players configure things themselves.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Wow. This idea is the best. I myself am colour blind, not as bad as you but the difference between brown and green (allies and normal cities) and green and red (allies and enemies) is pretty hard to recognize for me. I can not say how happy I am to see someone with such motivation and creativity. Wow. +1!!!
 

DeletedUser5819

Guest
The suggestion to enable the player to create a custom scheme which works for them, once for all is a great addition to the original idea. I doubt inno would do the research as that is pretty much the purpose of the ideas forum area, and certainly colourblindness is not all the same.

I was wondering for enemy/alliance markers whether shapechange on the banners might be an option. Taller, or triangular banners would stick out for everyone. Alternatively something like the highlight squares around which the OP used could give enough colour/pattern variety for almost anyone.
 

DeletedUser42393

Guest
Sorry for the disappearance, I had some RL problems. :Angry:

Anyway; I am back, and still colourblind - so it would make my year if this was voted quicker so that I can play properly, like everyone else.
 
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DeletedUser5819

Guest
Thanks Sj. I think it still needs to go through the ingame vote by all communities though. idk if it is still valid to debate or not.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Stop saying that you can manually set colors for alliances. You can do this, But for heavens sake, That's the point of this suggestion. If you unpact with your ally, You have to change the color again. That's what this suggestion is, To make playing as a colorblind player less work.

There's also the issue of the alliance rights as mentioned in the OP, which there is no option to change the color of.

You rocked that answer.
 
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