Pnp It's a Fairy Tale....

tommyfjh

Guest
Its very disappointing to see what started as a decent thread turn into just crappy smack talk. I may be a member of EQ (former ex-ruse/venom) but venom gained most of o55 when they recruited ruse and then EQ gained that when ruse un-merged from venom and joined the other half of ruse in EQ. Yet, that is somehow seen as backstabbing?

I'm all for banter and trying to rise a player from a hostile alliance into attacking me but seriously? The level of trash talk here is just shocking. Name-calling and insulting one another at this stage of the game? please just go back to school if you wanna behave like children cause no one wants to read that sounds like 'he said/she said'.

For those of you whining or puffing your chests, how about you sort this in-game rather than using a pathetic war of the words. Afterall, this is a war game :pro: Then we can let the stats talk.

Oh and btw no one cares about past worlds. If they did i'd be talking about world gamma (which kicked btw!) so lets keep this focused on rhammus shall we?
 

Ajax2014

Chiliarch
I think I acknowledged your city gains a couple of pages ago. And I said it was mostly Ex-Ruse taking cities from other Ex-ruse, then more ex-ruse joined you when the spots opened up in EQ for them to get in. But the stats don't reflect that. You also had to invite 95% of O55 to begin taking cities there when we were finally outnumbered in that ocean. Your stats don't reflect that either. Not that I really care, just wanted to point that out.
So yah, you guys are awesome fighters...
Not really. I have always been based in 55. 55 has been until lately a melting pot of players from many alliances....
 

Ajax2014

Chiliarch
I think everyone can clearly acknowledge the facts here. I make it EQ 157, Veno 51 so you have taken just over a 100 cities from Veno. :p
No one is failing to acknowledge that. I am no expert on Veno members but looking down your gains, there seem to be a large amount of inactive gains and ex-Ruse crossovers. I'm not saying that is wrong, it is part of the game but it if you are measuring the weighting of your fighting it does not bode too well. Active fighting between both alliances is not as skewed as the conquest stats. BP is the true measure of fighting and for an alliance which has had a member base 50% larger than our own over the WWs, your progress is not as extravagant as the conquest stats make out. At best you have been very very ordinary fighters.

I only joined because I got nagged by two of the three founders when we were a premade. Not trying to argue with you, just quoted you because it was another example of EQ posters taking what a Veno member says and blowing it out of proportion. EQ guys struggle to trash talk coherently. It is not that I'm trying to start an argument, I'm just pointing out that EQ arguments are not well thought out and hard to follow.

That for instance along with what I quoted earlier is hard to follow. Are you saying we don't know how to fight because with some face value psychoanalysis from all the trained Psychologists in EQ that certain Veno posters here appear to be ill mannered and therefore unable to play this game well. At the end of the day that is why we are posting here right? To trash out who is the better alliance/player purely based on the game we play. What war have EQ won exactly?



It is a shame that OV don't know how to play. :( Any tactical player who enjoys this game and wants a sense of achievement wants to have it out where its all happening. That tends to be the core and it is clear Inno intended that the WWs should include some fighting. Ever heard the saying if its easy its not worth doing? That is why I and various factions on this server resent EQ. If you built all 7 before anyone built one then I'd have no reason to disagree with your efforts. By building wonders in the middle of nowhere you have taken the battle away from the war.
You write: "It is not that I'm trying to start an argument, I'm just pointing out that EQ arguments are not well thought out and hard to follow."

Oh my. I create written arguments for a living in RL. I have trained others how to do that--for many, many years.....This comment just amuses me.....

And, yes, I love the fact that we are winning and will get the crown. I have spent the last six months working toward this goal. And when we were just Beta with a few members, it looked like a long shot. I have come to appreciate the intelligence of our leaders and members....That the third place alliance is trying to reframe the metrics for judging winning is transparent and childish. This game involves strategy and thought, not just raw aggression or the ability to rack up mindless BP.

And it amazes me that those who are losing will not simply congratulate the winners and move on but say they really are the winners....Poor sportsmanship and childish, and entertaining for me.
 

Ajax2014

Chiliarch
And political skill. Some in the third place alliance bemoan the mergers and recruiting of other players.....I admire that ability. You need to have the skills to recruit others.....Intelligence and strategic thinking actually matter in this game...it is not just about taking the next city.......Our team was playing chess, and the others were playing checkers.....They never really had a chance in the end, so focused on the trivial, they were.

Welcome to the NFL, as we would say on this side of the Pond.
 

posiden1239

Guest
"EQ guys struggle to trash talk coherently."

"That for instance along with what I quoted earlier is hard to follow. Are you saying we don't know how to fight because with some face value psychoanalysis from all the trained Psychologists in EQ that certain Veno posters here appear to be ill mannered and therefore unable to play this game well."
I'm not saying I agree with everyone from EQ that has commented on this thread but the things Fara was saying earlier were much worse than anything EQ members said from an argument standpoint.
As for you're second point I'll just clear up that I was saying Digi (not the entirety of Venom) calling another player he doesn't know much about a noob hurts his image on the forums (at least to me). I said nothing about his ability in game or Venoms ability, I truly respect both more than you'd know in game. Just explaining my previous quote as to not confuse anyone on my standpoint.

I agree with what Ajax said about having bad sportsmanship at the end. In the major world I played on, Xi (en14) when wonders were first introduced, my alliance had 20 guys so we fought hard and ended up in 3rd place even though we had no aspirations of winning. We still worked on a wonder and when the leading alliance won, we congratulated them and moved on. People can't seem to do that anymore.
 
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Internets

Chiliarch
JTin46

Please also note 14 of the cities Venominium conquered from EQ were from inactive players, I can give you the names and you can look it up. Another reason your argument is certainly invalid is that it is positive there were also RUSE players who gave up cities, one blue city in a full Venom island, foundlings in enemy territory, etc.

Keep it coming. I am now convinced that internet communities simply cannot be gentle. You are talking to someone across the world you will most likely never see, you cannot read emotions, as if you are talking to a computer, literally. Does it matter if I insult someone or argue over childish topics and behave immature? For you it doesn't, but the person on the other side of the screen it might. Think about that. I simply cannot be convinced that this is acceptable. I have always wondered, how hard is it, as an adult (which the majority of the Grepolis players are) to behave yourself like you would to anyone in the real world.
 
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JTin46

Strategos
I'm not saying I agree with everyone from EQ that has commented on this thread but the things Fara was saying earlier were much worse than anything EQ members said from an argument standpoint.
As for you're second point I'll just clear up that I was saying Digi (not the entirety of Venom) calling another player he doesn't know much about a noob hurts his image on the forums (at least to me). I said nothing about his ability in game or Venoms ability, I truly respect both more than you'd know in game.
I agree with what Ajax said about having bad sportsmanship at the end. In the major world I played on, Xi (en14) when wonders were first introduced, my alliance had 20 guys so we fought hard and ended up in 3rd place even though we had no aspirations of winning. We still worked on a wonder and when the leading alliance won, we congratulated them and moved on. People can't seem to do that anymore.
Yeah, I agree fara has said some questionable stuff. As I said earlier for these world discussions to work you need to keep to the game and not include all these personal attacks and rubbish like taking the moral high ground but thanks for clarifying once again. I gave my congratulations to EQ for the 4 WWs on my first proper post on this thread but it is a shame not everyone can bring themselves to do so. However, EQ are not home and dry yet so no need to 'break oot the bench beer' yet.
Please also note 14 of the cities Venominium conquered from EQ were from inactive players, I can give you the names and you can look it up. Another reason your argument is certainly invalid is that it is positive there were also RUSE players who gave up cities, one blue city in a full Venom island, foundlings in enemy territory, etc.
Keep it coming. I am now convinced that internet communities simply cannot be gentle. You are talking to someone across the world you will most likely never see, you cannot read emotions, as if you are talking to a computer, literally. Does it matter if I insult someone or argue over childish topics and behave immature? For you it doesn't, but the person on the other side of the screen it might. Think about that. I simply cannot be convinced that this is acceptable. I have always wondered, how hard is it, as an adult (which the majority of the Grepolis players are) to behave yourself like you would to anyone in the real world.
Yes, I've never claimed to be an expert on Veno conquests. I have never been linked with leadership so my knowledge on action with EQ is limited but naturally I was going to make an effort to interpret your positive conquests. However, we have already established Veno are behind on conquests and that is not the deciding factor on fighting ability so what do you have to say to boost your alliance? You have 50% extra fire power with that larger member base but it does not seem to account for much other than Ruse crossovers and inactives which we are guilty of too.
Not entirely sure what your second point is getting at other than EQ posters and one Veno poster. If you're referring too me then I am clueless as to when I have behaved childishly on this thread. If anything I have been attempting to achieve the opposite because as you say it is unnecessary to fling about non-game related stuff at each other. No harm with trash talking as long as its game related.
Oh my. I create written arguments for a living in RL. I have trained others how to do that--for many, many years.....This comment just amuses me.....

And, yes, I love the fact that we are winning and will get the crown. I have spent the last six months working toward this goal. And when we were just Beta with a few members, it looked like a long shot. I have come to appreciate the intelligence of our leaders and members....That the third place alliance is trying to reframe the metrics for judging winning is transparent and childish. This game involves strategy and thought, not just raw aggression or the ability to rack up mindless BP.
And it amazes me that those who are losing will not simply congratulate the winners and move on but say they really are the winners....Poor sportsmanship and childish, and entertaining for me.
Do you write political arguments by any chance? You're not there yet and I believe with good fortune we can turn it around. Re-framing the metrics for judging winning? If you have browsed through any Inno media you would know that WWs were intended to revolve around resource sending and fighting. You got to 4 WWs first but I deem it a hollow victory as fighting was out of the equation. Perhaps a more conventionally deserving winner would have been achieved if the WW requirements had been increased due to the speed of the server and someone could have challenged you for your wonders out there in no mans land. You talk of tactics but in the one top alliance I have led and other top alliances I have been fortunate to be a member of have always coupled that with integrity. Yes, I could have manipulated my alliance to come first on that server but I would have had to befriend a long-term enemy and wipe away over a year of differences. It is the same with Veno here, leaders could have got more members on board from enemies and gone against keeping ourselves slim and lean as an alliance but it would be embarrassing to go against the principles initially set out by our founders. It does not take much probing strategy to win wonders when you take the battle out of it. At Veno we were looking for a more thorough and traditional victory from what I read and there is still a slim chance of that happening. If not then congrats EQ but we can still cause you a lot of trouble until this world closes.

And political skill. Some in the third place alliance bemoan the mergers and recruiting of other players.....I admire that ability. You need to have the skills to recruit others.....Intelligence and strategic thinking actually matter in this game...it is not just about taking the next city.......Our team was playing chess, and the others were playing checkers.....They never really had a chance in the end, so focused on the trivial, they were.
Welcome to the NFL, as we would say on this side of the Pond.
As I say whilst that is an ability there are a large number of people on this game who have a backbone who wish to continue even if the odds are against them and that hardline strategy, largely sticking to what your alliance has always been is what I truly give merit too. Winning the wonders with a hardline strategy is where the real glory is at. I hope OV keep their remaining wonder a while so some greater strategy from someone will entail to clench the crown.

This pond seems very one sided.

Maybe stagger your replies next time, a lot to reply to right there haha
 

farabdul

Guest
I agree with what Ajax said about having bad sportsmanship at the end. In the major world I played on, Xi (en14) when wonders were first introduced, my alliance had 20 guys so we fought hard and ended up in 3rd place even though we had no aspirations of winning. We still worked on a wonder and when the leading alliance won, we congratulated them and moved on. People can't seem to do that anymore.
And I would do the same and did it on many occasions if my enemies were fighting hard and fair. EQ just didn't, you simply backstabbed us and after you are complaining about my comments. Since you are claiming that this is just a game then it should be played like one, i.e. you should have never merged to ex-ruse players knowing what they did. But you don't care, these days insulting comments are inhuman but betraying players, stabbing players and using dirty strategy is just a game. So please no need to tell me how horrible I am, at least I am saying what I think about EQ members directly to their faces.
 
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Ajax2014

Chiliarch
Yeah, I agree fara has said some questionable stuff. As I said earlier for these world discussions to work you need to keep to the game and not include all these personal attacks and rubbish like taking the moral high ground but thanks for clarifying once again. I gave my congratulations to EQ for the 4 WWs on my first proper post on this thread but it is a shame not everyone can bring themselves to do so. However, EQ are not home and dry yet so no need to 'break oot the bench beer' yet.

Yes, I've never claimed to be an expert on Veno conquests. I have never been linked with leadership so my knowledge on action with EQ is limited but naturally I was going to make an effort to interpret your positive conquests. However, we have already established Veno are behind on conquests and that is not the deciding factor on fighting ability so what do you have to say to boost your alliance? You have 50% extra fire power with that larger member base but it does not seem to account for much other than Ruse crossovers and inactives which we are guilty of too.
Not entirely sure what your second point is getting at other than EQ posters and one Veno poster. If you're referring too me then I am clueless as to when I have behaved childishly on this thread. If anything I have been attempting to achieve the opposite because as you say it is unnecessary to fling about non-game related stuff at each other. No harm with trash talking as long as its game related.

Do you write political arguments by any chance? You're not there yet and I believe with good fortune we can turn it around. Re-framing the metrics for judging winning? If you have browsed through any Inno media you would know that WWs were intended to revolve around resource sending and fighting. You got to 4 WWs first but I deem it a hollow victory as fighting was out of the equation. Perhaps a more conventionally deserving winner would have been achieved if the WW requirements had been increased due to the speed of the server and someone could have challenged you for your wonders out there in no mans land. You talk of tactics but in the one top alliance I have led and other top alliances I have been fortunate to be a member of have always coupled that with integrity. Yes, I could have manipulated my alliance to come first on that server but I would have had to befriend a long-term enemy and wipe away over a year of differences. It is the same with Veno here, leaders could have got more members on board from enemies and gone against keeping ourselves slim and lean as an alliance but it would be embarrassing to go against the principles initially set out by our founders. It does not take much probing strategy to win wonders when you take the battle out of it. At Veno we were looking for a more thorough and traditional victory from what I read and there is still a slim chance of that happening. If not then congrats EQ but we can still cause you a lot of trouble until this world closes.


As I say whilst that is an ability there are a large number of people on this game who have a backbone who wish to continue even if the odds are against them and that hardline strategy, largely sticking to what your alliance has always been is what I truly give merit too. Winning the wonders with a hardline strategy is where the real glory is at. I hope OV keep their remaining wonder a while so some greater strategy from someone will entail to clench the crown.

This pond seems very one sided.

Maybe stagger your replies next time, a lot to reply to right there haha

Thank you for an interesting response. You refrain from ad hominem attacks but basically repeat--in your response to me--that EQ is winning the wrong way. That is always in the eye of the beholder....
 

Digital Mystikz

Strategos
And I would do the same and did it on many occasions if my enemies were fighting hard and fair. EQ just didn't, you simply backstabbed us and after you are complaining about my comments. Since you are claiming that this is just a game then it should be played like one, i.e. you should have never merged to ex-ruse players knowing what they did. But you don't care, these days insulting comments are inhuman but betraying players, stabbing players and using dirty strategy is just a game. So please no need to tell me how horrible I am, at least I am saying what I think about EQ members directly to their faces.
No truer words have been spoken. As fara said, we have congratulated alliances in the past who have won wws with hard work, Planning and FIGHTING. The only hard work EQ did was sending resources, and you really did a fine job, No doubt about that. Seems both alliances think differently about "winning" and deserving to be congratulated. Fact is Venom is still here after all the troubles we've been through including the failed ruse thing. And seems only EQ players take what's written here so seriously and are obsessed with getting a pat on the back from the rest of the server, and you call us childish? Please...

Anyways, I hope OV will keep their ww for a little while longer as I believe there's still a lot of fun to be had in this server even though EQ wants to wrap this up quickly so they can go to the next server.

In our Venom chat room we can laugh about what gets written here, I advise EQ to lighten up and stop playing the "Venom members are mean to me" role.
 

Bond 007

Strategos
TBF, a win is a win, even if tactics are used which some people deem "unfair" or "simming", its what we have unfortunately. Its the fault of the system of the game, not the players. The players are here to win, so there is no point in accusing anyone. Blame the system for having an endgame which can be abused. Anyway, who doesn't like an easy win?

That being said, congratulations to EQ on winning, well done.
 

Corfuman

Phrourach
No truer words have been spoken. As fara said, we have congratulated alliances in the past who have won wws with hard work, Planning and FIGHTING. The only hard work EQ did was sending resources, and you really did a fine job, No doubt about that. Seems both alliances think differently about "winning" and deserving to be congratulated. Fact is Venom is still here after all the troubles we've been through including the failed ruse thing. And seems only EQ players take what's written here so seriously and are obsessed with getting a pat on the back from the rest of the server, and you call us childish? Please...

Anyways, I hope OV will keep their ww for a little while longer as I believe there's still a lot of fun to be had in this server even though EQ wants to wrap this up quickly so they can go to the next server.

In our Venom chat room we can laugh about what gets written here, I advise EQ to lighten up and stop playing the "Venom members are mean to me" role.
Hmmmm interesting, for 6 months nothing but complaints about the OV model for winning a server and how it is unfair, and a cheaters way of winning. Now another alliance EQ is the focus of the complaints, because they were able to overcome the OV core density population advantage.

However only one common denominator in this whole thing being "VEN doing the complaining"!!!!! :D
 

GothamSoldier

Phrourach
Wow...guess I missed a party...lol

I think a distinction should be drawn between the original Evo/Beta/EQ players like vulpes and Corfu who have executed a strategy on WW, building them in their core and making it work and the ex-RUSE players who turned traitor and stabbed VENOM in the back. They are two distinct groups of players...one of whom did play the game honorably from their starting position and another group who trashed an ally who did nothing but support them.

I wouldn't have a problem working with the former on a future world. The latter...well...lol...lets just say a friend's dog ate tacos with hot sauce the other nite...eating what came out the rear end would be more appealing than ever partnering with the ex-RUSE players again.

And lets not crow about that EQ "op" on MSR1 too much...guy was a loyal soldier for RUSE throughout the whole server (not leadership, just a soldier, sending defense to sieges and LTS when needed) and ex-RUSE decided to use his offline times against him for an "op." I informally polled VENOM leadership and nobody had seen something like that against a guy who was just playing his account and helping out, (rather than against a vocal leader who ticked off people)....that was pretty low by all our estimations.

Finally, as to Digi's challenge...go ahead. I DARE you. Re-form RUSE for the next low alliance cap world with decent settings if you got the cojones.... My team is close to ready. Check the pre-made section in about a month. And then come at us....we won't make the mistake of pacting with anyone again, so we will be taking on everyone.
 
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about 4 months ago i was watching two massive teams slug it out venom agains't OV in a great fight between 2 very good teams and it would seems to me both teams took their eye off the ball due to their hatred and their belief that this was a 2 team race and the winner of that fight would win the server and here we are looking back wondering who won that fight about as much as we are wondering who cares
sometimes in war games as well as war winning a battle means nothing to who is going to win the war and i guess winning a smack row here is also insignificant to who will win this server
i believe that there was 3 teams here that could have won and there was members of all 3 teams that gave it their all and their best
 

Digital Mystikz

Strategos
Hmmmm interesting, for 6 months nothing but complaints about the OV model for winning a server and how it is unfair, and a cheaters way of winning. Now another alliance EQ is the focus of the complaints, because they were able to overcome the OV core density population advantage.

However only one common denominator in this whole thing being "VEN doing the complaining"!!!!! :D
Not really complaining corfu, more like criticizing...
Yeah it's pretty weird how fast you guys fill up your ww's including the favor used to reduce the construction time, when OV had more members and was closer to their ww's. Some might say something smells fishy hehe
But i'm not accusing anyone :cool:
 

UKFirebrand

Chiliarch
Not really complaining corfu, more like criticizing...
Yeah it's pretty weird how fast you guys fill up your ww's including the favor used to reduce the construction time, when OV had more members and was closer to their ww's. Some might say something smells fishy hehe
But i'm not accusing anyone :cool:
Ha, ha. The only fishy thing was the unfortunate timing of the Troy event. Right in time for a WW to kick off, erm, early...

But I must agree Digital - I've only seen considered and impersonal critique on here. Hmmm..... :rolleyes:
 

sacmaster211

Phrourach
Wow...guess I missed a party...lol

I think a distinction should be drawn between the original Evo/Beta/EQ players like vulpes and Corfu who have executed a strategy on WW, building them in their core and making it work and the ex-RUSE players who turned traitor and stabbed VENOM in the back. They are two distinct groups of players...one of whom did play the game honorably from their starting position and another group who trashed an ally who did nothing but support them.

I wouldn't have a problem working with the former on a future world. The latter...well...lol...lets just say a friend's dog ate tacos with hot sauce the other nite...eating what came out the rear end would be more appealing than ever partnering with the ex-RUSE players again.

And lets not crow about that EQ "op" on MSR1 too much...guy was a loyal soldier for RUSE throughout the whole server (not leadership, just a soldier, sending defense to sieges and LTS when needed) and ex-RUSE decided to use his offline times against him for an "op." I informally polled VENOM leadership and nobody had seen something like that against a guy who was just playing his account and helping out, (rather than against a vocal leader who ticked off people)....that was pretty low by all our estimations.

Finally, as to Digi's challenge...go ahead. I DARE you. Re-form RUSE for the next low alliance cap world with decent settings if you got the cojones.... My team is close to ready. Check the pre-made section in about a month. And then come at us....we won't make the mistake of pacting with anyone again, so we will be taking on everyone.
I personally would agree to this challenge accept for the fact that I am already committed to a premade for such a world, you are welcome to find me in the next non-morale revolt world that isn't speed 1.
 

Digital Mystikz

Strategos
I personally would agree to this challenge accept for the fact that I am already committed to a premade for such a world, you are welcome to find me in the next non-morale revolt world that isn't speed 1.
We're going for a conquest world, the premade you're in is welcome to join us there...