Long Live WoE

Lorax34

Phrourach
Hats off to WoE..certainly the strongest group of players I have been up against. (...not necessarily the nicest, certainly not the funniest - but who came here for apple pie & jokes?)

Look forward to continued adventures with D.N.
 

darkpsyd

Phrourach
First of all, whether Derek is employed or not is none of anyone's business here. That is his personal life and please keep that away and stick to the game. Have some respect for someone as a human being.

I am from the SES and here's what I have to say:

Secondly, WoE fell because most of their players couldn't keep up anymore with the pressure. Period!

They had nothing left to throw with the amount of alliances down their throat... it became so bad that they were attacking with defense troops and ships (Lol). I know it's not funny but then again, they have themselves to blame for the monster that they created.

The one big mistake they made was recruit o65 players and when they saw 20+ cities fall in 10 days, it got a bit tough after that especially when they were not used to that kind of thrashing. Also, the SES added enormous pressure with the o56ers joining in from down south. Plus the alliances hitting in from the North like War Machine and all were too much to cope with. They were recruiting too many sim city players and other alliance defectors and this is a major reason for their demise.

Also WoE's diplomacy was terrible...it was evident.. I don't know why but it was.

I think this would be best to summarize an excellent [sic] Alliance's downfall.

Lesson for the day: Those who laugh last, laugh the most and Rychemaster & the rest of us from the SES are laughing away :D
 

BlackPaladin333

Guest
Diplomacy, what diplomacy? we didnt even have a diplomat :p
 

darkpsyd

Phrourach
Diplomacy, what diplomacy? we didnt even have a diplomat :p

If that be the case, then I wonder what theracerct and derek were doing with diplomacy where war machine was concerned. If that wasn't diplomacy they were trying to strike up north then I don't know what you would call it until the relations with war machine went sour?

Listen pal, everyone could go on and on and have a lot of WoE bashing here much to everyone's amusement but that isn't my point. Everyone knows what a mess you'll made by goin up north into o54 territory and as I said: "so much for some poor diplomacy".

Maybe no official diplomat but you'll had diplomacy in place when it was needed especially after the lashings started up North trying to keep War Machine from dissolving the pact. A lot of fun was being made of War Machine on these forums as well from WoE but all you'll got in return was the was long end of the stick from them. Hah!

Morale of the story: Keeping a diplomat and that too an official one goes a long way in favor during a war. And if you'll did have one, he went kaput!
 

BlackPaladin333

Guest
I think the main problem with WoE is that we didnt ever finish what we started, once we cleared SES almost completely from our core oceans it was like 'ok, thats over, lets move on' which just allowed SES to recruit and grow strong again. I think if we had disbanded them when we could then we would not have a stack of enemies, that made many of our players go inactive or join the other side.
 

darkpsyd

Phrourach
Exactly, you'll had a good chance and blew it. You'll gave us an inch to regroup and we took 120 miles of it in return. So that would now I suppose hint at poor management skills just as Ryche pointed out at WoE and you've also just pointed out as well :D

On the other hand I think you just complimented Ryche and Paras cause they got the smallest window possible and grabbed it... that shows that they obviously are excellent leaders ;)

Thank you very much!
 

gasper-kuhl

Guest
Exactly, you'll had a good chance and blew it. You'll gave us an inch to regroup and we took 120 miles of it in return. So that would now I suppose hint at poor management skills just as Ryche pointed out at WoE and you've also just pointed out as well :D

On the other hand I think you just complimented Ryche and Paras cause they got the smallest window possible and grabbed it... that shows that they obviously are excellent leaders ;)

Thank you very much!
Nicely written darkpsyd. And as I know it's against the rules to rebuke others on their grammar, I won't do it ;)
Also a little side-note, Skullyhoofd might be the most merciful mod ever! :D
 
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BlackPaladin333

Guest
Exactly, you'll had a good chance and blew it. You'll gave us an inch to regroup and we took 120 miles of it in return. So that would now I suppose hint at poor management skills just as Ryche pointed out at WoE and you've also just pointed out as well :D

On the other hand I think you just complimented Ryche and Paras cause they got the smallest window possible and grabbed it... that shows that they obviously are excellent leaders ;)

Thank you very much!
lol, no what I was suggesting is notthat it was the fault of our excellent management for not coax us into finishing SES off. No, I blame us for getting too bored of beating up SES and going to look for harder opponents :p

P.S. I think Rychemaster is quite a good leader (at least I know from Beta) but I think he would be even better if he stopped BS'ing about how great SES are (and were on Beta) and went without the sarcasm:

lol!!! US!!!! scare the mighty mighty WoE????
 

darkpsyd

Phrourach
lol, no what I was suggesting is notthat it was the fault of our excellent management for not coax us into finishing SES off. No, I blame us for getting too bored of beating up SES and going to look for harder opponents :p

P.S. I think Rychemaster is quite a good leader (at least I know from Beta) but I think he would be even better if he stopped BS'ing about how great SES are (and were on Beta) and went without the sarcasm:
You can rave and rant but here's what happened.

5-7 alliances fell to WoE before Armageddon.
SES had a narrow escape (I wonder why you'll didn't finish us off like the rest of the alliances? Strange)
You'll perpetually made fun of War Machine, Dushan The Mighty and the rest of the alliances up in o54.

So who were the harder opponents mate "at the end of the day"? I'll tell you.

SES slammed you'll in o65... I was privy to that on an hourly basis, starting with DMann45 and then davinius maximus, so on and so forth. 4 people did all the damage to about 30 WoE cities in o65--- gimix311, paras, luhar esob and myself.
Then we had Resurrection from o56 merging with SES and smashed you'll in o56 waters like there was no tomorrow.

And in regards to o55 which was your main territory, I saw ryche and paras having a field day everyday. Later we saw War Machine and Dushan The Mighty joining in and all hell broke loose for WoE.

Then came along the inactives, infighting, people leaving WoE... and at the end of the day, a complete collapse. To make matters worse, you'll have even changed your name to 'Warriors Forever'. How sentimental. HAHA!

I will agree to the FACT that WoE stood for a long time, no denying that but they fell. Now man up to it. And remember one thing... that small window will not be left open for WoE like it was for the SES... we will ensure of that.

Now tell me, where have I gone wrong in what I just said? Now if you say that I am wrong then I have nothing else to say to you. Hahaha!
 

BlackPaladin333

Guest
what window, all the current active WoE members will still join D.N. as soon as there is space...

I think our hardest opponents were SES because they were the only alliance we fought that were not trying to break INTO our ocean until later in our war, this allowed them to create a power base in a region where we did not conquer (outside our border). This would be much the same if WoE had invaded the SES core but SES refused to conquer into our core.
 

Inciatus

Guest
I will point out before the merge there was still a strong sentiment to stay WoE.
 

Scullionus

Guest
you'll (you will) have to just accept that it was down to inactivity that WoE chose to merge with D.N. yes they were fighting wars on every fronts and yes SeS seems to have been the last alliance left standing against them. Other then the late comers who also decided to jump on the band wagon.

Either way WoE has come to an end, you'll (you will) just have to accept that they were a good alliance and in my view a better alliance then SeS. Not sure how many people will agree with that but then lets see the stats.

http://www.grepostats.com/world/en18/alliance/112/history

http://www.grepostats.com/world/en18/alliance/362/history
 

DerekRisen001

Strategos
Scullionus: +Rep since I cant actually give you anymore right now...Lol. The stats I believe say all that needs to be said.

*Leaves the sigma forum once more.
 

Dalmasio

Guest
I have a alot of time for Derek but WoE cannot be deemed a better alliance than SeS simply based on stats alone.

Any alliance can conquer another into submission, sure they can be considered to be strong and mighty but can they be considered good?

WoE may have taken more SeS cities in the short term but SeS is still going strong whilst WoE is no longer. So in the long view - SeS proved to be the stronger alliance as it could be seen that they forced WoE into a position where merging was the only option.

Also if Grep was purely based on conquest - the game would be fairly dull. Alliances that use other tools such as diplomacy, understanding and communication seem to fair better in the long run.

Then there are the members themselves - an alliance is as only good as it's members and it's members are chosen by the leaders. It could be said that choosing members that run at the first sign of trouble or basically quit would be short sighted and a mistake on the part of it;s leadership. This inturn reflects the effectiveness or for a better choice of words (be it bad or good)the choices made by the leaders and thus the alliance as a whole. The leadership of SeS has managed to keep a good level of quality players within its ranks thoughout - perhaps SeS has a secret method of keeping their players interested in the game or maybe they were just lucky? Only they know.

Also, if an alliance is fighting more enemies than it can handle or can be considered fair - is that not down to poor alliance diplomacy and therefore can it not be said that it is their own fault and in the end due to their own weakness or naivety that took them down that path. Can an alliance that places themselves in a position like this be considered good? Surely it takes more skill to find and maintain a level of gaming equilibrium?

These points I raise a relatively vague and pointless but I hope to promote the idea to some of you that using stats to determine if one alliance is better than another is limited and gives a very myopic view of the whole picture.

Good alliances in my eyes are one's which are able to balance the war aspect of Grep to the diplomatic aspect - with the overall goal of keeping the members of the alliance interested and motivated throughout. And if an alliance can master this art - then surely they would be elevated from being a good alliance to one that is great.

This post isn't a WoE bashing one, I have a lot of respect for the players of WoE - in particular those from Epsilon, yes and that includes you Inc you Enlightened original:) But I think a more robust, complete and balanced picture should be created about rating alliances in general rather than just viewing the dullness of grepo-stats.....because doing that is just lazyyyyy boi and far less interesting!

This is slightly off-topic but it would I figured it would be better to try to evolve this thread into one where it moves on from "WoE is crap" followed by "No it isn't, it's better than SeS" as I'm sure it would soon end up with someone simply posting "Yur Momma" and all the fun and games end when someone gets infracted :(
Here is the special secret sauce about WoE - WoE's demise didn't come from inactives nor did it come from SeS and here is why ----> WoE when it started out looked like a great alliance because of the Epsilon originals - They were a close knit team of players that trusted each other and enjoyed playing with each other as they had been dominating Epsilon for a long time but many of them left fairly early and after they left it seemed more like Derek was more burdened with running WoE - WoE's original core of player basically killed themselves ironically because they are doing so well in Epsilon and thus didn't have the time to play both worlds effectively and still actually have a life. This basically meant that all the alliances that were fighting WoE - weren't really fighting WoE in it's prime but were instead fighting a faded, tired and world weary version.
 

darkpsyd

Phrourach
I have a alot of time for Derek but WoE cannot be deemed a better alliance than SeS simply based on stats alone.

Any alliance can conquer another into submission, sure they can be considered to be strong and mighty but can they be considered good?

WoE may have taken more SeS cities in the short term but SeS is still going strong whilst WoE is no longer. So in the long view - SeS proved to be the stronger alliance as it could be seen that they forced WoE into a position where merging was the only option.

Also if Grep was purely based on conquest - the game would be fairly dull. Alliances that use other tools such as diplomacy, understanding and communication seem to fair better in the long run.

Then there are the members themselves - an alliance is as only good as it's members and it's members are chosen by the leaders. It could be said that choosing members that run at the first sign of trouble or basically quit would be short sighted and a mistake on the part of it;s leadership. This inturn reflects the effectiveness or for a better choice of words (be it bad or good)the choices made by the leaders and thus the alliance as a whole. The leadership of SeS has managed to keep a good level of quality players within its ranks thoughout - perhaps SeS has a secret method of keeping their players interested in the game or maybe they were just lucky? Only they know.

Also, if an alliance is fighting more enemies than it can handle or can be considered fair - is that not down to poor alliance diplomacy and therefore can it not be said that it is their own fault and in the end due to their own weakness or naivety that took them down that path. Can an alliance that places themselves in a position like this be considered good? Surely it takes more skill to find and maintain a level of gaming equilibrium?

These points I raise a relatively vague and pointless but I hope to promote the idea to some of you that using stats to determine if one alliance is better than another is limited and gives a very myopic view of the whole picture.

Good alliances in my eyes are one's which are able to balance the war aspect of Grep to the diplomatic aspect - with the overall goal of keeping the members of the alliance interested and motivated throughout. And if an alliance can master this art - then surely they would be elevated from being a good alliance to one that is great.

This post isn't a WoE bashing one, I have a lot of respect for the players of WoE - in particular those from Epsilon, yes and that includes you Inc you Enlightened original:) But I think a more robust, complete and balanced picture should be created about rating alliances in general rather than just viewing the dullness of grepo-stats.....because doing that is just lazyyyyy boi and far less interesting!

This is slightly off-topic but it would I figured it would be better to try to evolve this thread into one where it moves on from "WoE is crap" followed by "No it isn't, it's better than SeS" as I'm sure it would soon end up with someone simply posting "Yur Momma" and all the fun and games end when someone gets infracted :(
Here is the special secret sauce about WoE - WoE's demise didn't come from inactives nor did it come from SeS and here is why ----> WoE when it started out looked like a great alliance because of the Epsilon originals - They were a close knit team of players that trusted each other and enjoyed playing with each other as they had been dominating Epsilon for a long time but many of them left fairly early and after they left it seemed more like Derek was more burdened with running WoE - WoE's original core of player basically killed themselves ironically because they are doing so well in Epsilon and thus didn't have the time to play both worlds effectively and still actually have a life. This basically meant that all the alliances that were fighting WoE - weren't really fighting WoE in it's prime but were instead fighting a faded, tired and world weary version.

Brilliantly put! Epic post:)

(oops, post too short)
 

BlackPaladin333

Guest
lol, so what he just said is that SES and a tonne of other alliances got destroyed by a half-WoE :p

I take that as a compliment :)
 

Mrs.Sativa

Guest
Wow this is still going. :heh:

The point is WoE is not around anymore and ses is. :pro:
So now lets get on to whats going on now and talk about more interesting things.Besides an alliance that is not around anymore ;)
 

darkpsyd

Phrourach
lol, so what he just said is that SES and a tonne of other alliances got destroyed by a half-WoE :p

I take that as a compliment :)
Never denied WoE was awesome, full or half or quarter! Only a fool would deny them that right!

And if WoE weren't there, Sigma would be the worst world around!

My point is they got too far beyond what they could reach.. big issue being they recruited renegades and a lot of deserters.... plus a big - point would be recruiting the deserters of Coming Soon... the fall started soon after :)

I give due where due is given but not past that.. the SES is still around and doing fantastically owing to great teamwork and brilliant leadership and WoE is no more!

RIP WoE!

Long Live the South East Syndicate!!! :D