New Goddess Aphrodite Feedback Thread

[DeletedUser56181]

Thanks bacon, but read the post again, i was refering to somebody else. No I'm not new.

@Hydna Will they try to do something with the Game Breaking Sirens Pasives??? beacuse as it was stated multiple times on forum, IT IS GAME BREAKING when u can time every improtant attack with them for like 20 times! Why dont ppl in inno care?

 

[Hydna]

Thanks bacon, but read the post again, i was refering to somebody else. No I'm not new.

@Hydna Will they try to do something with the Game Breaking Sirens Pasives??? beacuse as it was stated multiple times on forum, IT IS GAME BREAKING when u can time every improtant attack with them for like 20 times! Why dont ppl in inno care?

Sirens are super fast, allow for additional multiple timing chances and they will also make it harder to work out what is in an attack. All of this is intended behaviour to enhance the strategic possibilities. Give them a chance before declaring they are game breaking. We will review what happens and the feedback from players of course but you need to try it first.

 

[Lethal-Bacon]

Thanks bacon, but read the post again, i was refering to somebody else. No I'm not new.

@Hydna Will they try to do something with the Game Breaking Sirens Pasives??? beacuse as it was stated multiple times on forum, IT IS GAME BREAKING when u can time every improtant attack with them for like 20 times! Why dont ppl in inno care?

bruh.. its intended gameplay to mix and spice things up, is it a on island slinger hc, is it a catapult attack, is it a cs? you will never know..
but i do hope you think its a slinger hc at 3 am and go back to sleep as i put you in siege

 

[Shuri2060]

Sirens are super fast, allow for additional multiple timing chances and they will also make it harder to work out what is in an attack. All of this is intended behaviour to enhance the strategic possibilities. Give them a chance before declaring they are game breaking. We will review what happens and the feedback from players of course but you need to try it first.

Do we really need to demonstrate to you that 50+ tries per city is unhealthy for the game?

Just wait til the tickets come rolling in about 'cheaters' getting everything on the same second...

 

[Kotyara]

Sirens are super fast, allow for additional multiple timing chances and they will also make it harder to work out what is in an attack. All of this is intended behaviour to enhance the strategic possibilities. Give them a chance before declaring they are game breaking. We will review what happens and the feedback from players of course but you need to try it first.

The way sirens stack is the problem.
I don't think too many has problem with the additional movement speed, it's all about how BADLY it's implemented.
I personally think there is TOO many anchors already in the game, but atleast it's somewhat balanced.

You could very easily just put a limit on the bonus and put ranges of the bonuses, if they are so stubborn to add multiple new anchors.
1-19 sirens - 20% bonus, 20-49 40% bonus, 50+ 60% bonus etc.
Even if I think it's by far best to have a set bonus and don't stack them, which by itself is really good already but not game-breaking like now.

If the dev team don't understand from start how 50 possible re-timings is bad.. Then we are really doomed and I'm afraid what is waiting for us in the future. You might as well just remove the anti-timing all together at this point.(Don't take it as a suggestion.......)

I gave it a shot with a open mind to see if my initial worries were unwarranted.
And....It was even more game-breaking then I were afraid it would be. Not even a challenge anymore to do perfect timings.
And I'm not even a top-tier player, hell some would argue I might not even be a decent one even.

Personally I won't touch any Aphrodite enabled server until this mess is sorted. As my last hope in the devs is they don't allow something as this broken.

 

[DeletedUser55437]

everyone is on the same level though, everyone can abuse them so its balanced between the players

 

[DeletedUser56817]

Players have been asking for more gods for years, and Im happy to see one new one at last, but the siren takes away one of the important game-play elements that people take pride in, their ability to time attacks and defenses. It will hurt participation in revolt worlds and as said above there are already issues in conquest worlds with the spell. Id like to see the Sirens and the Narcissist spell revamped to address the feedback so far.
Id also like to see the rest of the Pantheon in the game

 

[Shuri2060]

everyone is on the same level though, everyone can abuse them so its balanced between the players

Might as well do away with the anti-timer then

 

[DeletedUser55437]

ok yeah lets do that great idea lol

 

[Sorin Markov]

The way sirens stack is the problem.
I don't think too many has problem with the additional movement speed, it's all about how BADLY it's implemented.
I personally think there is TOO many anchors already in the game, but atleast it's somewhat balanced.

You could very easily just put a limit on the bonus and put ranges of the bonuses, if they are so stubborn to add multiple new anchors.
1-19 sirens - 20% bonus, 20-49 40% bonus, 50+ 60% bonus etc.
Even if I think it's by far best to have a set bonus and don't stack them, which by itself is really good already but not game-breaking like now.

If the dev team don't understand from start how 50 possible re-timings is bad.. Then we are really doomed and I'm afraid what is waiting for us in the future. You might as well just remove the anti-timing all together at this point.(Don't take it as a suggestion.......)

I gave it a shot with a open mind to see if my initial worries were unwarranted.
And....It was even more game-breaking then I were afraid it would be. Not even a challenge anymore to do perfect timings.
And I'm not even a top-tier player, hell some would argue I might not even be a decent one even.

Personally I won't touch any Aphrodite enabled server until this mess is sorted. As my last hope in the devs is they don't allow something as this broken.

Not only is it just straight broken, it's boring. Timing attacks normally is interesting because you have to act fast to get as many sends as possible, but with this it's just the 4 or so clicks you need in a row until you get what you need. It's boring gameplay. Also the ability to disguise whatever attacks you send is kinda boring. Being able to at least kind of tell what your enemy is sending is a good part of the game and if your enemy is smart they can still disguise it without sirens.

All in all, Aphrodite is a very offensively-focused patron and I expect defending with her in the world will be next to impossible. The next patron they release would have to be very strong for defenders to balance it out, but I'd prefer if Aphrodite were just reworked.

 

[Sorin Markov]

By the way,


I have never heard such absolute lies from Grepo, and I struggle to refrain myself to calling it just that. I can think of many more creative names. I have not yet seen one player with even a mediocre understanding of the game and Aphrodite who has had a positive reaction to her.

Passing this patron and thinking it's balanced? That was pretty uncool, but that's fine mistakes happen and can be corrected.
Not listening to your entire fanbase who told you it was broken and unfun and how to fix it? That made me pretty mad, ngl.
Claiming we all love it when the above happened? What is this, North Korea???
It's like these are pre-recorded messages and players don't have any actual voice! If Aphrodite doesn't get changed significantly, I may not play more worlds once the non-Aphro ones are done. You will lose players over this, Innogames, listen to your fanbase. This is what kills games.

 

[Lethal-Bacon]

By the way,
View attachment 14809

I have never heard such absolute lies from Grepo, and I struggle to refrain myself to calling it just that. I can think of many more creative names. I have not yet seen one player with even a mediocre understanding of the game and Aphrodite who has had a positive reaction to her.

Passing this patron and thinking it's balanced? That was pretty uncool, but that's fine mistakes happen and can be corrected.
Not listening to your entire fanbase who told you it was broken and unfun and how to fix it? That made me pretty mad, ngl.
Claiming we all love it when the above happened? What is this, North Korea???
It's like these are pre-recorded messages and players don't have any actual voice! If Aphrodite doesn't get changed significantly, I may not play more worlds once the non-Aphro ones are done. You will lose players over this, Innogames, listen to your fanbase. This is what kills games.

truth be told, if beta market discussion thread and en market discussion thread did not favor the slight game breaking addons from this god, maybe majority of other markets liked her and the new spells/units/features she brings.

 

[Shuri2060]

Well they're not wrong. Plenty of passion here, and I guess we're beloved. I guess. Maybe.

 

[Hydna]

As I said before the issue that you raise with timing is intended and we want you to give the world/Aphrodite a chance. I can remember worlds where players had so many cities that timing had to all be within a few secs of the cs - we just cancelled the ones that weren't. These days a lot would have looked at the lineups and assumed a bot. Sirens give everyone extra chances - thats both sides of a takeover so its a challenge.

Theres also the fact that you cant have all your cities as Aphrodite without impacting other key areas that also matter - thats a strategy decision for a player and an alliance but it does mean that you cant time everything with sirens in any case. The more sirens you discard when timing the lower the nuke power so that is also a tradeoff. There is so much here that needs to be tried and tested before just declaring one or a few aspects are an issue.

I like the look of Aphrodite and I know a lot of players who feel the same. It's a new addition to grep that will bring an extra dimension. Ares is the same and in time changes can and will be made if the current setup doesn't work.

 

[Sorin Markov]

Ares is the same and in time changes can and will be made if the current setup doesn't work.

I don't remember that being said. Possible leak? :O
That is exactly who I was hoping for though. Honestly, he should have Heroic Power and Athena should get something else. But that's just an opinion.

 

[Spartan AD]

Can't be bothered to post a long response so here goes.

As I said before the issue that you raise with timing is intended and we want you to give the world/Aphrodite a chance. I can remember worlds where players had so many cities that timing had to all be within a few secs of the cs - we just cancelled the ones that weren't. These days a lot would have looked at the lineups and assumed a bot.

Don't know what this means.

Sirens give everyone extra chances - thats both sides of a takeover so its a challenge.

Closes skill gap.

Theres also the fact that you cant have all your cities as Aphrodite without impacting other key areas that also matter - thats a strategy decision for a player and an alliance but it does mean that you cant time everything with sirens in any case. The more sirens you discard when timing the lower the nuke power so that is also a tradeoff. There is so much here that needs to be tried and tested before just declaring one or a few aspects are an issue.

This is fine, no-one really minds that much about the other stuff, sirens are the key game-breaker.

I like the look of Aphrodite and I know a lot of players who feel the same. It's a new addition to grep that will bring an extra dimension. Ares is the same and in time changes can and will be made if the current setup doesn't work.

 

[Shuri2060]

As I said before the issue that you raise with timing is intended and we want you to give the world/Aphrodite a chance. I can remember worlds where players had so many cities that timing had to all be within a few secs of the cs - we just cancelled the ones that weren't. These days a lot would have looked at the lineups and assumed a bot. Sirens give everyone extra chances - thats both sides of a takeover so its a challenge.

I don't understand. The issue raised isn't the physical incapability of fully timing cities close to each other. The issue raised is the absurd number of tries you get per city. You might as well remove the anti-timer completely because with Sirens anything can be timed to the second with a success rate close to 99%.

Not sure how bots are relevant. To my experience, players screaming 'bot' on timings are just ignorant. The only time to suspect someone is using a bot is if they're getting 10-20 tries per anchor, otherwise the ticket submitted to support is just done for a sanity check. There are likely 'gives' that allow support tools to differentiate between timing done by a bot and timing done by a human (eg. clicks done at exact intervals apart), but nothing you yourself can tell if you're being timed on and the opponent is getting a human number of tries in. The crux of the issue is the lack of info/guides on the subject which causes the lack of awareness in the general community. Very few players with the knowledge are willing to share it outside of their alliances. Those who do, I respect them for it - they're the ones trying to keep this game alive.

Yes, Aphrodite gives everyone 'extra chances' in the sense that it lowers the skill cap drastically so 'anyone' can get a few cities on the second they want, unlike before. However what you don't seem to realise is that while previous mediocre players will now be able to get maybe half of their commands 0-2 seconds away, decent players will be able to get absolutely everything on the second they want. If there was a gap between decent and highly skilled timers before, it barely exists with Aphrodite any more.

Theres also the fact that you cant have all your cities as Aphrodite without impacting other key areas that also matter - thats a strategy decision for a player and an alliance but it does mean that you cant time everything with sirens in any case. The more sirens you discard when timing the lower the nuke power so that is also a tradeoff. There is so much here that needs to be tried and tested before just declaring one or a few aspects are an issue.

I can assure you there isn't much to try and test. 1 Siren is enough to double anchor tries, 10 (=160 pop) is enough for even an average player to have broken timings, decent players would probably barely need 5 per city. That's 80 pop which is like 2% power, some players spend more on trips, buildings and stuff. The attack power of the Sirens themselves is irrelevant - they'd be pretty much the same amount of broken if they had no atk/def power. For players to even be concerned about their atk/def power, you'd have to make them be in the negative thousands.

Also, any player with reasonable amount of experience is going to deduce they only need Sirens/Aphrodite in cities they're likely to time from. There's no need to make cities away from frontlines Aph, it's obvious those can be other gods. Little is lost, much is gained from switching all timing cities to Aph. Sure, sometimes it's better to have Hades for OFF/DEF purposes in Revolt, that kind of thing, but in almost all cases, it's going to be better to have her to increase timing chances/cut CS times/mask attacks.

I like the look of Aphrodite and I know a lot of players who feel the same. It's a new addition to grep that will bring an extra dimension. Ares is the same and in time changes can and will be made if the current setup doesn't work.

Yes I like the look of Aphrodite too. The visuals are on the goddess and spells are pretty good. But that's not the issue here. You're cutting several dimensions of skill here with regards to timing, spotting attacks, and much more.

 

[Hydna]

I don't have Aphrodite as a god in the new world? Why?

Aphrodite is in Chios. If you scroll down the god list in the temple she is at the bottom.

 

[DeletedUser54192]

@Sorin Markov @Spartan AD
The introduction of Ares has been previously mentioned, on the Facebook page if I remember correctly. I believe that they revealed the images and possibly the names for Ares' mythical units as well, although not any statistics or spell descriptions. It was obvious that we were getting two gods as opposed to just one, as the unit panel for DioTools was picking up 4 new slots as opposed to just 2. They haven't released any information about Ares on the Beta forum yet, and I imagine it may be a little while until he is actually introduced to the game (if for no other reason than staggered release allows the developers to observe the impact of each god separately).

While there may be significant positive feedback on markets other than EN/Beta, I wouldn't be entirely surprised if the implication of community-wide positivity is extrapolated from a minority of positive feedback - there have been multiple situations in the past where Inno has cited 'feedback' as the reason for changes, but the players have been unable to find said feedback, or it turned out to be a minority opinion that was more convenient for InnoGames to follow.

I do like the concept of a new god, as well as the visual elements. I just feel that the mechanical aspects may not have been completely balanced. Two very powerful spells, two weak spells (the stacking concept is fun, but requires too much input to make the spells reach a good level). Sirens, as many people have said, seem too powerful - a flat speed bonus for having 1+ Siren in your attack would likely have been alright, but stacking per Siren for up to 50 Sirens seems a bit too much. Satyrs are fine in general, but I think the speed is a bit excessive. The weak spells don't really counter the strong spells/myths, as it just makes it an easier choice of what to spend favour on (no-one complains that Zeus or Artemis are weak gods due to Lightning Bolt or Illusion respectively). I do need to play a world with her on to make a final decision, but the theory definitely puts her at a significant advantage over other gods when it comes to combat.

 

[Shuri2060]

The feedback doesn't look positive on de forums either (using auto-translate). On the other hand, it appears to be much more constructive than general en forum feedback... something we could all work on if we want to be listened to.

===

On a side note, this gave me a good laugh