question On Conquering Cities

Attila the Gun

Guest
Been debating this on my alliance's forum. I have been arguing that taking 200 and 300 point cities is a waste of time and resources. But others have argued in favor saying that ultimately you have more free population to work with and for troops plus you have less risk of that person having wasted his research points on . I still feel like taking sub 2,000 points is a waste of time and resources. Thoughts?
 

Kadjayuni

Guest
this is a morale world, 1k cities are better. If I have 14 x 1k cities and you have 14 x 13k cities your morale sux and I have more troops.
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
Please explain. How do you have more troops? I read up quickly on morale. Morale seems like a mixed bag. I have only been playing for three weeks.
 
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Jorisva1

Polemarch
Please explain. How do you have more troops? And what does the size of each city have to do with morale? I have only been playing for lik three weeks.
Hello Attila,

The start of the game is always the most difficult part.
How do you have more troops?
Well, it's easy to explain.

Every building you construct needs a certain amount of population. Once you build something you'll loose population. Now, once your city reaches 10k points, it usually fulfills all the basic needs of a city, and the rest of the buildings aren't really needed. Which means that you would use more population to build an (unneeded) 13k city than to build a 10k city. So, you'll have the possibility to build a larger army if you only use the basic levels of your buildings. ;)

Your second question: It has (indirectly) something to do with the size of your cities. Morale is calculated by a formula taking into account the total points of the attacker and the defender (I don not know the exact formula). If the defender has significantly lower points than the attacker, the defender will profit from morale which means that he gets a small defending bonus (as the attacker's troops won't be at 100% fighting power).

So basically, the lower the points of the defender, the better ;)

Though, I wouldn't really change your game style based on morale. Just build your buildings to a 10k city, and make a good amount of troops and you'll be able to resist the attacks anyway. I always say, morale is for noobs ;)


I hope my answer was sufficient.

Joris
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
Hello Attila,

The start of the game is always the most difficult part.
How do you have more troops?
Well, it's easy to explain.

Every building you construct needs a certain amount of population. Once you build something you'll loose population. Now, once your city reaches 10k points, it usually fulfills all the basic needs of a city, and the rest of the buildings aren't really needed. Which means that you would use more population to build an (unneeded) 13k city than to build a 10k city. So, you'll have the possibility to build a larger army if you only use the basic levels of your buildings. ;)

Your second question: It has (indirectly) something to do with the size of your cities. Morale is calculated by a formula taking into account the total points of the attacker and the defender (I don not know the exact formula). If the defender has significantly lower points than the attacker, the defender will profit from morale which means that he gets a small defending bonus (as the attacker's troops won't be at 100% fighting power).

So basically, the lower the points of the defender, the better ;)

Though, I wouldn't really change your game style based on morale. Just build your buildings to a 10k city, and make a good amount of troops and you'll be able to resist the attacks anyway. I always say, morale is for noobs ;)


I hope my answer was sufficient.

Joris
After the first reply I read up on Morale. I get why it is here, but it really seems like a mixed bag. Thank you for the reply it was quite helpful. It sounded like the other guy was advocating have tons of 1,000 point cities. So once my cities hit 10,000 points I should stop leveling up buildings? So is it better to have tons of sub 10,000 cities?
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
After the first reply I read up on Morale. I get why it is here, but it really seems like a mixed bag. Thank you for the reply it was quite helpful. It sounded like the other guy was advocating have tons of 1,000 point cities. So once my cities hit 10,000 points I should stop leveling up buildings? So is it better to have tons of sub 10,000 cities?
Well depends,

It's always best to have maxed resource buildings, senate to 20, maxed harbor, maxed barracks, maxed wall and maxed temple. The rest doesn't really matter, you do not really have to have them maxed, but just high enough for the basic needs. :) And it turns out that goes just fine around 9-10k points. :)

With having 'tons' of 10k cities you'll be able to create a larger army than people with the same amount of cities, but 13k cities. As they waste a lot of population. :)

And the army is the key to success ;)
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
Why max out my harbor? I know it needs to be level 20 in order to build colony ships. I appreciate the help. How many of my cities should be capable of building colony ships and conquering other cities? Also should I specialize my cities? For example my alliance leader suggests making one city just for offensive nukes or bireme nukes.
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
Why max out my harbor? I know it needs to be level 20 in order to build colony ships. I appreciate the help. How many of my cities should be capable of building colony ships and conquering other cities? Also should I specialize my cities? For example my alliance leader suggests making one city just for offensive nukes or bireme nukes.
Your alliance leader is correct. It's always better to have specialized cities instead of mixed cities.
Just an easy example:
If you have offs and defs mixed in one city, your offs won't be sufficient to clear an enemy city...and when under attack you'll make great damage because you don't have enough defensive units.

Most 'pro' players devide their cities in a few categories:
- Bireme cities (specialized in naval technologies and biremes (of course): in which you can build up to 300+ biremes
- LS cities Same as bireme cities, but the for Light Ships (best offensive ship). You can build an avarage of 250 LS per city
- Def cities: Swords, Archers and hops (+ light transports to carry them) to defend your frontline cities under attack
- Off cities (slingers, horses, small amount of hops, etc etc...) to attack other people.


Though, if you only have one city it's better to have a little of all. Only when you have more than 1 city you should make the categories.
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
My first city is mixed, as it was my first. But now I have a total of four cities. Should I change the makeup of my first city? If so what should I specialize it in? And how many of my cities should be capable of making colony ships and have conquest researched?
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
My first city is mixed, as it was my first. But now I have a total of four cities. Should I change the makeup of my first city? If so what should I specialize it in? And how many of my cities should be capable of making colony ships and have conquest researched?
I would personally suggest to make ALL your cities capable of conquerring. Though, there are people that would disagree with me. It both has their benefits. Check what suits you best ;)

Now, I can't really say how you should make your cities. Because that depends on you. For example, a frequently attacked account will have a bigger def ration than a player that's never under attack.

But as a regular player I'd (I think) suggest 1 off city, 1 def city, 1 LS city, 1 bireme city. And then making your fifth an other def city.

Though, again, it all depends on your game style. I tend to play 'safe'. But if you are more the type of player to be aggressive you might want to choose for a bigger off ratio. (making your fifth off).
 

Kadjayuni

Guest
Well depends,

It's always best to have maxed resource buildings, senate to 20, maxed harbor, maxed barracks, maxed wall and maxed temple. The rest doesn't really matter, you do not really have to have them maxed, but just high enough for the basic needs. :) And it turns out that goes just fine around 9-10k points. :)

With having 'tons' of 10k cities you'll be able to create a larger army than people with the same amount of cities, but 13k cities. As they waste a lot of population. :)

And the army is the key to success ;)

Senate 20? why? the maximum level you need if someone LB's your harbor to rebuild the harbor level is 14. You can build extra troops with the farm space for 6 levels of senate.

Maxed harbor? I've actually never maxed my harbor, not even no morale worlds, There is no point building harbor above lvl 20, and for example in a flight city there is really no point in building it above lvl 1. Unless you are an avid summoner of the phoenican and use it to gold whore.

Maxed resources? You must be a simmer :p you get far more resources from looting other players with the increased number of troops than you will from maxing your resource camps.

Maxed wall? I have alot of difficulty with this one, you see I don't build walls at all. In fact I find it funny when people earthquake me :D

Maxed temple? This only works effectively on revolt worlds, as the tactic of using only myth units is not viable on conquest and you will find your favor is maxed and going to waste with 2-3 lvl 10 temples. Build them as high as you need them for the myth units you want to produce.
 
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Attila the Gun

Guest
I was wondering what the point of maxing my harbor was since you only need level 20 in order to build colony ships. @ Kadjayuni There is a point to having a senate at level 20 or higher, you need it in order to build thermal baths, tower, etc. But I suppose the need for those buildings could be debated. Also you assume there are always players nearby to loot. Currently I have very few viable targets nearby to loot. Unless I would send troops away to cities that are 4 or 5 hours away or even longer. How are city walls useless? Please elaborate.
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
I was wondering what the point of maxing my harbor was since you only need level 20 in order to build colony ships. @ Kadjayuni There is a point to having a senate at level 20 or higher, you need it in order to build thermal baths, tower, etc. But I suppose the need for those buildings could be debated. Also you assume there are always players nearby to loot. Currently I have very few viable targets nearby to loot. Unless I would send troops away to cities that are 4 or 5 hours away or even longer. How are city walls useless? Please elaborate.
City walls are not at all useless. :p Some people play that way. But once under attack they'll quickly review that point. Max city walls.
And indeed, level 20 for harbor is sufficient. I was confused and though 20 was it's max level ;)

You need your senate to build those building. But once they are contructed the senate isn't needed any longer. That's why you could choose to demolish it to a lower level (14 seems perfect to me, though, that's totally up to you). By demolishing your senate to a lower level your other buildings won't be lost, and you'll gain more population. :D
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
Thank you for the tips and advice. Is there a point to building libraries, towers, etc.? I have also heard that Triremes are practically useless is that correct?
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
Thank you for the tips and advice. Is there a point to building libraries, towers, etc.? I have also heard that Triremes are practically useless is that correct?
Triremes aren't useless; but I wouldn't advise you to build them.
Triremes are good for defense and offense. But if we make some simple calculations you'll notice that you'll have a bigger profit by building biremes instead. It's cheaper, and takes less time to build.

Libraries I personally have never built that. I consider it useless, but others disagree. You'll have to find that out for yourself.

Towers are extremely useful, I think everyone will agree with that.
By building towers on your frontline cities you'll have a better defending force (I don't know the exact percentage). On long time you'll have fewer loss after a big battle ;)
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
A city I conquered has a library. If I demolish it will I lose the things that were researched using those extra research points?
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
A city I conquered has a library. If I demolish it will I lose the things that were researched using those extra research points?
I'm not very sure about that, but I would say yes. Unless of course these points weren't used.
I mean, if library gives you 10 (I don't know the amount, just as example) points, and if you check your library and have 11 points left...then you'll have 1 point left after you demolished your Library. No technologies will be reset.
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
I'm not very sure about that, but I would say yes. Unless of course these points weren't used.
I mean, if library gives you 10 (I don't know the amount, just as example) points, and if you check your library and have 11 points left...then you'll have 1 point left after you demolished your Library. No technologies will be reset.
That was my question, whether or not I'd lose things that had been researched using those points. Also that city has an oracle. Is it useful having an oracle or is there a better building to replace it with? Thank you. :)
 

Jorisva1

Polemarch
That was my question, whether or not I'd lose things that had been researched using those points. Also that city has an oracle. Is it useful having an oracle or is there a better building to replace it with? Thank you. :)
Oracles are useful. As they'll tell you if your city has been spied on at all time. Yet, I usually don't build it. Tower or devine statue would be my choice
 

Attila the Gun

Guest
Awesome. Thank you. I am thinking of replacing my library with the thermal baths. Is that my best choice? Seems like the best one to replace the library.