Slings vs. Hoplites

Shadis

Guest
Okay okay I know this has been discussed many times before but let's just discuss it again, seeing as I was never part of the other discussions :p okay we all know that hops take more time and resources to make than slings but let's look at the advantages/disadvantages of both hops and slings:

Slings:
Wood:55
Stone:100
Silver:40
Total resources required: 195

Speed: 28

Time to make (on a world speed two): 9 mins 32 seconds

Defense: 7 blunt, 8 sharp, 2 distance

Hoplites:
Wood:0
Stone: 150
Silver: 75
Total resources required: 225

Speed:12

Time to make (on world speed two): 10 mins 58 seconds

Defense: 18 blunt, 12 sharp, 7 distance

Okay so slings are cheaper by 30 resources, not that much, and they take 1 min 26 seconds less. They are the worse possible for defense. About two times faster than hops.

Hops have a higher defensive value, meaning they would contribute more in an assault than slings and You would lose less hops in an attack than slings, normally. Plus most people build more swords than archers.

Would anyone care to give there opinions between slings and hops?
 

GheHD

Guest
Side By Side Review:

Now here is my opinion:

You can't call one better than the other. They both have there own jobs which they do well. Slingers will take out a Slinger nuke easily while Hoplites will take out a Hoplite nuke. So I would recruit whichever will do the job more efficiently.
 

Shadis

Guest
Side By Side Review:

Now here is my opinion:

You can't call one better than the other. They both have there own jobs which they do well. Slingers will take out a Slinger nuke easily while Hoplites will take out a Hoplite nuke. So I would recruit whichever will do the job more efficiently.
Which was my original opinion, but the thing is most people recruit swords (sometimes I see huge archer turtle but not normally), hence hops gain more importance. In general, the most I see is slings vs swords (or am I the only one?), which wouldn't work as well as hops vs swords. So with more swords, there should be more hops, but there's not (and its just ridiculous when people send wave after wave of slings at cerbs :rolleyes:). The only thing I can think of that is stopping people from making tons of hops is its time and cost of silver..

I'm sure there's another reason for mainly slings but I'm missing it :/..
 
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spookytooth1

Guest
at 1 min extra to build and doing 7 less damage hops loose hands down.1 min may not sound like much but multy it by 1700 and it adds up.Their defencive value is not even worth looking at as as far as i know it counts for nothing in attacks,Sure if they have hades little doggys slingers loose,but then you should have spied first and moved on to some other city :)
 

DeletedUser38828

Guest
I prefer using Hoplites as my nuke.

Just because they seem a lot more elite than slingers.

Also its the Def credentials that matters.
 

GheHD

Guest
Which was my original opinion, but the thing is most people recruit swords (sometimes I see huge archer turtle but not normally), hence hops gain more importance. In general, the most I see is slings vs swords (or am I the only one?), which wouldn't work as well as hops vs swords. So with more swords, there should be more hops, but there's not (and its just ridiculous when people send wave after wave of slings at cerbs :rolleyes:). The only thing I can think of that is stopping people from making tons of hops is its time and cost of silver..

I'm sure there's another reason for mainly slings but I'm missing it :/..
Speed possibly?
 

spookytooth1

Guest
I prefer using Hoplites as my nuke.

Just because they seem a lot more elite than slingers.

Also its the Def credentials that matters.
the last time i really took to hitting a alliance they were very keen on hops,after 2 weeks of my slingers slaughtering them they changed tact and my spies couldn't find any more hops :)
 

Thomas

Guest
It depends on the type of player that you are... If you have LOADS of bireme cities, you'll have loads of silver left over, hoplites are a good choice as you can basically fund their production from these bireme cities.

I personally prefer slingers however... they are cheap and quick to produce, in theta i didn't really have any other type of offensive unit which was bad, as you have said, they are not great against swordsmen. However, you can rebuild the nuke uber fast. Took me a day or two to get a 1500 strong slinger nuke back up to size.
 

Shadis

Guest
Speed possibly?
Already said that :p

As for Thomas, so what if you have a 1500 sling nuke when I have 1000 swords and 20+ walls? You'd need around 2700 slings for that while about 1100 hops..
 

Shadis

Guest
I do see where slings speed comes in handy though :) so kudos for that. I just did a test. One of my city can currently hold 10k, so I maxed out the resources and here's what I got: 70 slings possible, 60 hops possible, so not big difference there. I'd say speed is the only thing that gives slings a chance :p
 

Thomas

Guest
Get allies to help, its what i do.
You could say the same for archers.

If i had 1500 archers, what would you do?

The answer is, they are completely different units with completely different pros and cons... A better comparison would be between Chariots and Hoplites IMO.
 

Shadis

Guest
Get allies to help, its what i do.
You could say the same for archers.

If i had 1500 archers, what would you do?

The answer is, they are completely different units with completely different pros and cons... A better comparison would be between Chariots and Hoplites IMO.
On the contrary Thomas, I could get my allies to help with hops.

And remember, the thing is most people use more swords than archers, so while that's possible to have 1500 archers it's not as likely as 1500 swords.

I'm trying to find which has more pros, slings or hops (that's what I meant by vs(oh and hops not chariots :p))
 

DeletedUser25380

Guest
A point that noone brought up yet is how easily they die against just walls and militia, hops die a lot faster than slings.

IMO a better offence is a balanced mix of the three weapons for each offence, however your strategy might depend on how many cities you have. Also maybe you have some myths nukes too (usually mantis and harpys, resulting in no distance weapon nuke). And your strategy might depend on who you are fighting and what they use for defence, i.e. it is easier to defeat (in offence and defence) an enemy whose habits you are familiar with. There were some players we knew were using hops and chariots, we adjusted some troops especially for them :p

Same goes for defence, I think because the majority of players use slingers, defence is geared towards swords and cerberus. There are less defence against blunt in general, because most blunt weapons take so long to build. I am wondering why you aren't comparing a blunt weapon too?

Another point, it might depend whether you share islands with your enemy and how active you are, do you wish to leave troops in your offensive cities to protect your walls and prevent countless quick and cheap land revolts (assuming revolt world) - in that case you might have some chariots and hops laying around.

Personally it really annoys me that hops are so imbalanced in their resource building needs, all these trades are painful. However an island with the right trades can be a good fit.
 
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DeletedUser50581

Guest
I would just train whatever unit that is more efficient. Plus, in the academy, you can research the phalanx witch make your units fight 10% stronger. And plus both units have their specific jobs to do. But in my opinion for defence and offence, you should train hoplites. So stop this debate over which unit (slinger vs hoplite) is better because sometimes, it just depends on your (pop) and (I)(W)(R) because the more resources you have, the more units you can train. Peace out :cool:
 

DeletedUser31385

Guest
Depends on what you are planning to attack. Slingers would be good on harpies while hoplites not so much.
 

DeletedUser2663

Guest
It always comes down to what the other guy has. As people have said most people prefer slinger nukes due to the more balanced resource expenditure, quicker build times and offensive power. But that being said we see that most defense compositions put a heavy emphasis on ranged defense, eg cerb and swords. Now because of this slingers loose their offensive potential and in this game the end result is the only thing that matters. So lets say your alliance is doing an OP and you have nothing but sling nukes and your target has a well rounded defense built to own your slings. Sure you can throw your armies at him and wipe out a ton of his forces but at the end of the day you wont take his city. However in this situation if you had say a few hop nukes (i always love to complement hop nukes with myth support eg medusa's due to myths having higher power per pop) all of a sudden your specialised sharp nuke can either greatly weaken your opponent initial defense with a better trade than a sling nuke would or even deal the killing blow wiping his reduced defense.)

However the hop has one strong point in its favour in conquest worlds which is its decent defense stats which allow it to be used in the colony ship attack to give you a greater chance to survive potential offensive ground backsnipes while the rest of your support arrives in. No point wasting all your nukes and landing a cs full of offensive troops if the only battle those troops in the cs force will be fighting is the counter snipe of your opponent. hoplite chariot compositions give a very nicely rounded out defense to hold the fort down and with prior spying you can identify the opponents forces at that city and build a comp ratio designed to survive the backsnipe

Basically its down to the player having all the tools at his disposal to fit any situation. You can build nothing but sling nukes and do just fine but it will only limit the range of situations where you can be truely effective.

Also a note on efficiency, this is very importaint, you want to get as much bp as possible while giving your opponent as little as possible in order to allow you to out grow your opponent.
 
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DeletedUser30931

Guest
Depends on location of enemies, how many cities you have, trades on island, distance between your cities, and your playing style.