Proposal Special Building Revamp

DeletedUser50935

Guest
Proposal:Revamp almost all special buildings, so players actually build varied special buildings.
Reason:Almost everyone (on revolt anyway) builds baths/tower.

Details:
Theater: Make theater players a viable way of getting culture points, make them a lot cheaper to do and ideally quicker then a victory procession.

Thermal Baths: No revamp required.

Library: Increase the amount of research points gained to a point where (assuming the player's is at max level) a player can research every technology. "The Grand Library in your polis gives your scholars access to infinite knowledge and the power to research all the divine technologies available in the academy taking your polis to a whole new level."

Lighthouse:Offer a boost to the power of the players navy rather then just the speed (offering a choice for LS cities, more ships or more powerful ships) don't know how balanced this would be so left %'s blank.
"The searching beam of your lighthouse finds your sailors in the darkest of oceans, this allow your ships to find paths through the most treacherous waters increasing the speed of your fleet by (X)%, its beam also inspires your sailors and they fight with renewed vigour in every battle, increasing the offensive power of your navy by (X)%"

Tower: No revamp needed.

Divine Statue: Prevents all negative spells from being cast on the city.
"The Greek God's notice the people of your polis that worship every day and find themselves no longer wishing ill upon them, negative spells cast on your polis will have no effect."

Oracle: Cant think of a good revamp but one is required.

Merchant Shop: "Merchants from far and wide flock to your polis as it becomes a bustling trade hub. The Phoenician merchant leaves a representative in your city and his offers refresh every 1 hour. Your farming villagers also respect the trading hub within your polis and now offer 50% more resources with every demand"

Visual Aids:n/a

Balance/Abuse Prevention: Some of these ideas dont even seem balanced to me. But the general idea is special buildings need a revamp so they are all relevant. I don't care what form this comes in.
 

DeletedUser31385

Guest
Proposal:Revamp almost all special buildings, so players actually build varied special buildings.
Reason:Almost everyone (on revolt anyway) builds baths/tower.

Details:
Theater: Make theater players a viable way of getting culture points, make them a lot cheaper to do and ideally quicker then a victory procession.

Thermal Baths: No revamp required.

Library: Increase the amount of research points gained to a point where (assuming the player's is at max level) a player can research every technology. "The Grand Library in your polis gives your scholars access to infinite knowledge and the power to research all the divine technologies available in the academy taking your polis to a whole new level."

Lighthouse:Offer a boost to the power of the players navy rather then just the speed (offering a choice for LS cities, more ships or more powerful ships) don't know how balanced this would be so left %'s blank.
"The searching beam of your lighthouse finds your sailors in the darkest of oceans, this allow your ships to find paths through the most treacherous waters increasing the speed of your fleet by (X)%, its beam also inspires your sailors and they fight with renewed vigour in every battle, increasing the offensive power of your navy by (X)%"

Tower: No revamp needed.

Divine Statue: Prevents all negative spells from being cast on the city.
"The Greek God's notice the people of your polis that worship every day and find themselves no longer wishing ill upon them, negative spells cast on your polis will have no effect."

Oracle: Cant think of a good revamp but one is required.

Merchant Shop: "Merchants from far and wide flock to your polis as it becomes a bustling trade hub. The Phoenician merchant leaves a representative in your city and his offers refresh every 1 hour. Your farming villagers also respect the trading hub within your polis and now offer 50% more resources with every demand"

Visual Aids:n/a

Balance/Abuse Prevention: Some of these ideas dont even seem balanced to me. But the general idea is special buildings need a revamp so they are all relevant. I don't care what form this comes in.

How about for oracle.... It could give a 10% increase to your spies and also provide some knowledge regarding incoming attacks (not a complete picture of the attack).
 

DeletedUser50935

Guest
10% increase to spies is already available through researching espionage but I like the idea of a picture of incoming attacks (but don't know what "some knowledge" would show).
Do you think the revamps I suggested are fairly balanced though?
 

DeletedUser31385

Guest
Divine statue is overpowered. Negative spells still need to be able to do damage to cities.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I don't support any special building revamps in the second group. I'm afraid they could be overpowered then. It's problem of players they automatically build the tower, even though the divine statue, merchant shop (to greater resource supporting of cities on frontline from cities in ally base) can be sometimes much more useful. Oracle is also a good one. However, the bath doesn't have any rival, it's true.
These changes were suggested by the devteam in 2013:
Owning a theatre will passively reduce the duration of all celebrations by 20% and it will reduce the costs of the city festival to these values:12.000 Wood, 15.000 Stone, 12.000 Silver.(Mind that the Theatre Play as a standalone celebration will be removed due to this change)
Lighthouse:+20% speed for ships.
Library:Will grant 24 additional research points.

Excluding the library change they are fine. The academy itself provides enough research points, so this amount should be lowered or the library needs to provide absolutely different bonus. Library is a place for knowledge... so, what about a cheaper (in way of resources and/or time) units/buildings?

Do you really think it's necessary to quote every single post even though it's the previous one? Messing up the forum... :(
 

DeletedUser54192

Guest
The second group of special buildings actually sees a significantly higher degree of variety in conquest, based on my own experiences on Olous, and talking with others who have played conquest for a while. Because defence bonuses aren't good when trying to break a siege in your city, a tower is no longer a necessity, and is only really useful if you can guarantee to stack the city with enough defence to prevent the enemy from getting a CS inside in the first place. With the tower not being mandatory, it opens up the others as decent options, although I don't see the oracle as much as the divine statue or merchant's shop.
 

DeletedUser50935

Guest
As somebody that only plays revolt every city is Baths/Tower which does get a little monotonous and kinda ruins the point of a 'special' building, divine statue and merchant shop are good for WW but I don't really see much use in the oracle, surely it's better to stack your cave, I also don't see much use in any of the first group buildings apart from baths so I would support the changes that were proposed however I think they would have to happen in conjunction with baths being nerfed as I still don't see how they would be on the same level as baths.
 

DeletedUser54192

Guest
Having a boost on naval strength as per the Lighthouse improvement would easily be on a level with baths if the strength bonus was 10%, in my opinion. Thermal Baths would give 10% more LS, Lighthouse would give 10% stronger LS. I'd pick the stronger LS for an LS city any day, because it means that I am getting the same attack power on full-sized nukes, and getting more attack power for the amount of resources that I spend on the LS. Also, having fewer LS means you lose less of them to Sea Storm (although you do lose more firepower for each single LS lost). The crucial part of that is in a CS escort. With lighthouse, you'd have a stronger LS escort still without risking Sea Storm.

The problem with a library isn't (in my opinion) that it doesn't give enough research points - it's that if you are any good at specialising your cities, you shouldn't need any extra research points. You only need those points if you are trying to build a city capable of lots of different things, and this tends to lead you into the trap of trying to do multiple things with one city, therefore decreasing the strength in any one area.

I like the idea of buffing the theater, but making it give CPs quicker than a victory procession isn't a great idea in my opinion. Victory processions are the quickest way to earn a CP, and this means that players are pushed to fight in order to expand, unless they decide to sim entirely or pump a lot of gold into Olympic Games. If you made a cheap and quick resouce-driven method of gaining CPs, you'd make it a lot easier to sim and avoid fighting, which isn't a great thing to be doing when a lot of the complaints on forums nowadays are that people aren't fighting enough, and are just simming all the way to WWs. Also, it would run the risk of almost completely invalidating city festivals - instead you would send the resources to theatre cities and get it converted into CP more quickly there.
 

DeletedUser50935

Guest
I just think theater's are almost completely irrelevant (I don't think I have ever seen a theater built) but yeah I agree, processions should still be the main way of gaining CP and as you mentioned above it's difficult to boost the theater without invalidating city festivals, but maybe any kind of 'festival' should only be available with the theater so to gain CP via resources you'd have to have a theater. As for library I agree with what Thasoss said, maybe cheaper units would be viable for a boost to the library, I think those boosts along with the boost for lighthouse would make the first set fairly balanced but I'm not 100% on not being able to have festivals without the theater.
 

DeletedUser54192

Guest
The theater already provides a unique CP generation option, in the form of theater plays, which are cheaper than city festivals. The thing is, a theatre play takes a lot longer (5 days divided by world speed, I think), and the resource difference isn't that much when you consider that most players tend to only get theaters later on, when the amounts of resources being thrown around are a lot higher. I personally think that the theatre could be fixed just by making theatre plays a more viable CP-generating method, whether that is through cutting the time or resource cost a bit, or something like that.
 
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