Tales from a red ocean (pnp)

[DeletedUser]

daizan you talk entirely too much about irrelevant points. so ill just answer with two points.

I must say it's mighty hypocritical of you to call them cowards when you surrendered to your enemies and how can you say they are cowards, when they chose to stay in PV knowing full well when a war broke out they would outnumbered 12/1 or 5/1 in cities. I think you are just bitter about the fact the enemy you ditched CS to join is proving to be nothing more than an MRA with one or two good players.

ive notice you saying this whole "surrendering to the enemy" quite a few times. yet you absorbed shine, some of catharsis, nemesis, circle of shadows, and now a good group of confed players. who knows how many others. at the beginning of this world you were constantly defending absorbing the enemy calling it "strategy"

so whats the difference between us?

you want to know the answer? the difference is we merged to make the game more fun. you merged to avoid war. that was your argument wasnt it?

now you try to mock us for merging to initiate war and talk about how youre a war machine. that is what i call hypocritical

second point. when you took in our players confed still existed, we still had a pact, and you were all taking gotcha cities. so when war came, no they would not have been outnumbered like you said. thats simply the truth.



hilop
i meant have the strange knights with us in the war against PV. with that scenerio i have to disagree. you have no idea how quickly players have stepped up now that war is being thrown in their face. against bk, like you said, war was 40 hours away. personally i think it was a failure of okc to have the pacts that he did but things were different then and cant be compared to now. which is why i say i wonder...

berserxes
i never saw those threads. if you remember middy had the same idea but with ocean 35. he had lots of volunteers. i was one of them.

i agree with the fact you had your reasons to leave. i wont argue or try to talk about you negatively there. i just think its wrong to say, at one point, the best players shouldnt be in a pact together and at another point, join the largest alliance on the world, thereby eliminating the last few players that could stand up against it. this is especially true when you were asked to come back

pv was invading our ocean. like it or not war was coming. we all knew it. we simply took the initiative and fought back before we got rolled over. imagine how many enemies you would have had you stayed. daizan, pyth, soc, celso, anderxes, armandix, privatejoker, milos... instead you fight with them.

ill just end it there because i think thats all that really needs to be said

 

[DeletedUser14385]

just a point...merging into a pact member is a diplomatic agreement, normaly designed to deal with inactives and dropouts

merging into an enemy is capitulating and being forced to terms because you cant beat them

having an enemy merg into you is WOOHOO time because youve beaten them bloody, forced them to terms and picked the cream of their players to fight for you

 

[DeletedUser]

just a point...merging into a pact member is a diplomatic agreement, normaly designed to deal with inactives and dropouts

merging into an enemy is capitulating and being forced to terms because you cant beat them

having an enemy merg into you is WOOHOO time because youve beaten them bloody, forced them to terms and picked the cream of their players to fight for you

ok berx just because i like you, one last post

1. see daizans post. apparently cs and pv had no pact
2. ok then. bk merged into cs. we won. woohoo.
3. what is it then when you absorb the players first then declare war on whats left as pv has done a few times now?

you see how none of those things makes any difference?

had we continued to war with bk, pv would have just came after what was left whether it was cs or bk. continuing to war with each other when a third alliance was taking cities in our ocean would have just been plain stupid.

PV would have declared war at some point. you know it, we know it, daizan knows it. the only reason anyone is arguing or in daizans case, insulting the other side is because we played smart and didnt allow them to simply walk into ocean 45. that my friend is strategy. same as pv has done in the past

ive said my peace now

 

[DeletedUser14385]

im not now nor would i ever moan about it...im glad you merged into bk, its livened things up nicely, my post at the top is supposed to be "tongue in cheek"

it seems its whats left cs that are moaning about the few of us that joined pv more than anything else and with comments like...

join the largest alliance on the world, thereby eliminating the last few players that could stand up against it.

...it seems you dont have much faith in who your stuck carrying, its a shame because you have some quality players left, if they werent constantly dragged down by the trash ones

 

[DeletedUser]

ok berx just because i like you, one last post

...

had we continued to war with bk, pv would have just came after what was left whether it was cs or bk. continuing to war with each other when a third alliance was taking cities in our ocean would have just been plain stupid.

Well said, Against Me.

And, some of us actually RESPECTED the BK Leadership, from previous assocations, prior to the dumbarsed war we had going on.

But, what do I know about Strategy - I'm just a Newb, after all, eh?

 

[DeletedUser]

Hmm seems you are blind Pyth. As you can see 4 out of those 6 days I was on VM.

4 out of 7 on VM is fine, if you're happy with 178 ABP in the 3 other days then who am i to judge

 

[DeletedUser8969]

whatever leadership was left after both okc and richard v left for cs is what screwed things up. we had a peaceable merge with cs agreed to which either richard v didn't properly communicate or the leadership when richard v left decided not to communicate.

what happened is some people came over as part of the agreement and some did not. when it became clear that all that had been asked to come over were not going to, daizan gave the option to those who had already come over to go back if they wanted to since the merge mess created by CS leadership left them in a bad position. most stayed having had their fill of CS leadership.

we were going to attack nemesis since they appeared to be weak. instead we were approached by some of the few active remaining members of nemesis who hated their current leader and wanted to pull a julius caesar. we helped with that and took in their good players.

most of our top guys have been in the alliance since the beginning. i don't think we have a single shine person remaining in the alliance. i don't know that we have any catharsis members or circle of shadows members left either.

CS could have merged their actives into PV and some did and some didn't. some surrendered and merged into BK.

PV was not invading o45. we were invited in by richard V since he was going to merge his active guys into our alliance. proof of this was supplied to then CS leaders when they whinged about PV moving in o45. somewhat disingenuously i believe.

getting your facts straight is prob a good start guys. good luck with your internal and ghost city conquests.

 

[DeletedUser]

Interesting perception. Like most PnP - some plausible small truths surrounded by a tissue of lies.

In point of fact, the Snake made damned sure that CS died by delaying, dissembling and speaking half-truths to Richard V.

Those of us who weren't invited (Thank you, higher Power, for my lack of ABP!) and a lot of those who were invited, chose to forge our own path, unencumbered by previous management's lack of focus.

I give great credit to the people who hung in with us, and are now in a strong Alliance with an equal (or greater) number of good players from other like-minded groups.

Nice try, Sock... but your lot only play to the Pit. Use Churchill, not Goebbels as your model next time, k?

 

[DeletedUser8969]

lol. once you start agreeing with me i'll know that i'm wrong.

 

[DeletedUser5061]

daizan you talk entirely too much about irrelevant points. so ill just answer with two points.

ive notice you saying this whole "surrendering to the enemy" quite a few times. yet you absorbed shine, some of catharsis, nemesis, circle of shadows, and now a good group of confed players. who knows how many others. at the beginning of this world you were constantly defending absorbing the enemy calling it "strategy"

so whats the difference between us?

you want to know the answer? the difference is we merged to make the game more fun. you merged to avoid war. that was your argument wasnt it?

ok berx just because i like you, one last post

1. see daizans post. apparently cs and pv had no pact
2. ok then. bk merged into cs. we won. woohoo.
3. what is it then when you absorb the players first then declare war on whats left as pv has done a few times now?

you see how none of those things makes any difference?

had we continued to war with bk, pv would have just came after what was left whether it was cs or bk. continuing to war with each other when a third alliance was taking cities in our ocean would have just been plain stupid.

PV would have declared war at some point. you know it, we know it, daizan knows it. the only reason anyone is arguing or in daizans case, insulting the other side is because we played smart and didnt allow them to simply walk into ocean 45. that my friend is strategy. same as pv has done in the past

ive said my peace now

apparently I talk entirely too much about irrelevant points. so ill just answer a few points.

1. see daizans post. It said even though we were suppose to be allies with CS, it was always more like a NAP, since we didn't have shared forums to do ops or help each other out just tried to stay out of each other. NAP is a acronyms for a Non Aggression Pact, so when did I say we didn't have a pact.

2. wake up. bk never merged into cs. you didn't win, you lost. no woohoo for you. bk offered you asylum, pv and bk war not warring, we had an entire ocean between us, they didn't need a merge, you felt you did.

3. people assume pv absorb the players first then declare war on whats left, they assume pv has done it few times now, pv just let them assume as they please, what does it matter what others think when we're number one in ABP. When we decided expand to 44 you can't blame anyone for wanting to join us when the best alliances in that ocean was either led by The Great Toast or didn't have any leadership at all. When we decided to expand to 55 we recruited three players who had quit Xi already, siek who as friend of one of our leaders, Princess and Jen, you would have to be gay not to want them in your team. The rest either followed their friends, who either wanted rain gone or to get away from him.

PV doesn't recruit its enemies, it recruits aggressive players and nice people, when you recruit your enemies they are the first to their back on you when the going gets tough and spit on the alliance the offered them asylum, just take JimiCanuck and yourself a former member of The Jr. Illuminati who's butt CS kicked as example of that, I am sure you two had great big smiles on your face when CS submitted itself to its enemies.


Anyways welcome to the forums, love the Against Me alias.

 

[DeletedUser]

I don't see what all the fuss is about, it's turned out how it has turned out and that is that guys and girls.

It is what it is from all the different perspectives.

IMO locations played a big part as did trust, the inactives and other intangibles and I sure as hell aint gonna criticise anyone for making their own choices.

I believe Daizan and PV handled the ever evolving situation honorably but can't blame zoos, sondek, delph etc for taking the path they did either, it's been a good move for them and I can understand the cloak and dagger approach they had to take and maybe some trust issues they had as things developed with BK. No problem, I called it way before it happened and those whom I had openly been pm ing from CS and BK gradually stopped the text which is fair play.

Plenty of good players on both sides so let's have it!

 

[DeletedUser]

Always respected you, manos, always will - as a player and a man.

A worthy enemy, you are, amigo.