The retirement of a spy

Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
Hello everyone,

I have been playing the game for many years. I have enjoyed it very much. This is a war game. Conflict of armies are a very small part of a war. Resource and human management, diplomacy, propaganda, and spionage are all integral part of wars.

I have real life issues and I have to quit the game for some time. However, I need to confess something for the good of the game.

I joined No Brakes, but I had been passing information to the opposition. Only one or two people were aware of this. It was not the moderators or the biases. I was one of the people who was passing intel. This is why the opposition knew so many details about internals, vacation modes, strategy.

To make it real, I even attacked the Killer Bees and almost all of them did not know that I was communicating with one of their leaders.

As for my motives, one was just curiosity. The other one was that although Erik treated me well; others did not and I did not see treating others well. This is my opinion.

If yo treat your members with dignity and not just as mere soldiers; then they will give you loyalty. If you just demand in an authocratic manner; then sooner or later you say why bother.

My cities are for grabs. Good luck to everyone. My apologies to Erik and Sam.

Also my apologies to the moderators. They were blamed for something that I was doing. I think that someone else was also passing information too.
 

Ki-Borg

Phrourach
I hope you are happy now?
This is exactly how some players are destroying this game and making many others to leave ...
 

Tangy Tom

Guest
Laying blame for your own actions at the door of other players is despicable. If you are happy to be a spy it is all about you, either pat yourself on the back or keep quiet.
 

Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
Don't worry, spies are now lauded in this game and can still be accepted, just ask avanya :)
I must say that perhaps people are maturing here at Grepolis. Spionage and Counterespionage are key elements of any armed conflict.

Nothing to look bad on a spy. If anything, I hope that now alliances are more careful in their ways to detect spies. It just makes the game more fun.

I also must admit that it was quite fun to spy. It made the game more interesting and not as boring. It was also interesting to see the differences in the cultures of both alliances.

I also got a kick from teasing the Killer Bees. They did not know that I was helping them which made it all a bit more twisted. I also had to think carefully how not to get detected. Which information to pass, which not to pass. When to pass it . How to fake attacks, etc.

It was a really interesting and fun journey.

I think that I did a good job in keeping the Bees and Brakes from not suspecting me. The mass ghosting did not took me by surprise. I asked our opponents to push at the right moment. I knew that things were falling apart.

I think that it was fun for the guy in the other end because he also had to keep his information a bit close.
 

Tea city

Guest
Hahahahaha,you are so amusing noob.
1. Check your own words- at the start you said I even attacked Killer Bees tgough I was in touch with their leader.
In your last post you say I did a good job in keeping the Bees in not suspecting me.
Now how come you were in chat and passing Intel to one of their leaders and they did not suspect you?:d
What happened between the time of your first post and the last one?
Did you get told in game you were spying for Jarndog (shrawanr) and you asked how do you know this?;)

Because dear noob Tim (who instructed you what to post) is not the only one to do some things;)
He did keep your name secret but he also had to write some where he had a source.

2. The reason why you spied (and that you confirmed ) is such as to make every one shake the head.
To cut short on April 29 you were revolted by Bees in two cities you had deep in their zone.
One was there for some time and jut a week prior or so we helped you drunkard defend it since you were in a party and got drunk.
Bees lost around 12k ls and failed To take it.

Since you are a born noob you a few days later colonized another close To the first and got revolted in both during one of their ops.
You are not a gold abuser to make this type of ventures a success by building in a few hours at least Senate 21,wall 20 and a tower.
Bees were killing our defense in your thrill city as it landed since it was at a good tactical advantage for them-close to their base and you had no researches and tower.
I noted this and asked you why you colonized deep in their rear without consulting a leader first.
Your reply was-for strategic reasons.
What reasons?
To divert attention of Bees from my other city lol
So you,who was keeping one city deep in their rear with LTS from the alliance simply created a other burden for our defense.
Since you already had a city same island and unable to cover it yourself I decided in my quality as a leader To let that tiny 1300 point city go and authorized the recall of the defense and took responsibility for this in forum as well as in my mail To you (since you said I an be punished for losing a city lol).
Apparently you think the alliance is a sachet you can put your hand To take way you want lol.

For your caprice we were losing defense,and once your latest thrill went unheeded due to my intervention you went in the extreme of becoming a spy.
All can see what a character you are.

3. You with this post simply made the last favor To Jarndog.
A careful eye can see your (his more correct) effort To remove attention from the real reason why NB ghosted in protest.
Unfortunately Baudin will delete my post if I continue but all know for what am I talking about.

You kid are giving yourself an importance you never had (it was you btw who wrote the forgery of Karlo,discredited by the mm of your master that I posted here in externals ).
I am sure Tom spoiled your sick childish ego for his own ends but kid,you were never even for a second part of Council so To claim you passed sensitive info for our inactives,bans and strategy is just a reflection of your self delusion.
You were just a forum reader( the only true thing you said was that there was another leak and we were aware of this and acted accordingly to reduce damage)with no chance To know things prior to others and dear noob as a rule our Council members had i nactives tripped way before official posting:d
So we knew first when x inactive was discovered and posted in time generally.
And you fed Tim with accurate info about our strategy?:d
Now that's a claim lol
Since to my knowledge it was known just by myself And Erik lol
But perhaps you know better lol.
And regarding attackable bans all NB players can testify that only one was ever made public in time for you To pass the info (that of maxi) and only two deep cities were lost so your effort To remove the blame for x thing is simply lame;)

4. You are also wrong in thinking none suspected on you.
The net was drawing tighter on you since it was easily discernible you had a change after the mentioned incident.
Prior you were active in forums and you went silent.
Your master should have instructed you better lol

Try as much as you want To describe yourself as a Kim,at max you are just a Tim;)
 
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Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
Thank you for reminding me why I took the correct decision. You are a condescending jerk, and I regret that I was part of your alliance. I am glad that you went down. I hope that you learn your lesson. You need to learn a lot in life. This is not about the strategic issue. It is about you guys treating people like dirt.

If I have to do it again to you, I do it. You and your crew are awful meanyheads I have to be fair that Erik treat me well and so Sam.

I
 
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Tea city

Guest
Thank you for reminding me why I took the correct decision. You are a condescending jerk, and I regret that I was part of your alliance. I am glad that you went down. I hope that you learn your lesson. You need to learn a lot in life. This is not about the strategic issue. It is about you guys treating people like dirt.

If I have to do it again to you, I do it. You and your crew are awful meanyheads. I have to be fair that Erik treat me well and so Sam.

I
Thank you for confirmation first hand of the reason that pushed you to be a spy for muskets;)
Namely a 1300 point city you colonized in the midle of Bees by becoming an extra burden for our defense.
All this barely a week after this alliance that you betrayed sacrificed countless biremes for you(who were drunk after a party).
Your language is very similar to that of funkiller so good choice;)
It is admirable your public self suicide by being so loyal to Tim:d
Unfortunately childishness is not always accompanied by smartness and the effort of Jarndog to kill multiple birds with one stone failed so miserably by your inattentive posts which counter each other;)
It is amusing the effort of weasy and Tim to direct the blame on bees as well as to remove attention from their "jewel" by burning you publicly to convince the world that a random foolish spy is the one to be blamed for our mass protest and not the "magic hand".
Admirable your courage to proclaim yourself a Kim being just a bad copy of Tim:d
 
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Tea city

Guest
However, I need to confess something for the good of the game.

I joined No Brakes, but I had been passing information to the opposition. Only one or two people were aware of this. It was not the moderators or the biases. I was one of the people who was passing intel. This is why the opposition knew so many details about internals, vacation modes, strategy.

To make it real, I even attacked the Killer Bees and almost all of them did not know that I was communicating with one of their leaders.

As for my motives, one was just curiosity. The other one was that although Erik treated me well; others did not and I did not see treating others well. This is my opinion.

If yo treat your members with dignity and not just as mere soldiers; then they will give you loyalty. If you just demand in an authocratic manner; then sooner or later you say why bother.


Also my apologies to the moderators. They were blamed for something that I was doing. I think that someone else was also passing information too.
before being edited I am saving the most precious part.
To be noted the care of the "Kim" to remove attention from the.....
oh well name can not be mentioned otherwise the post might be found off topic:D
 

Tea city

Guest
Just found an interesting mail dear baby spy:D

Quetzalea
Hell House on 2016-05-03 at 21:09
Mate,you have completely misunderstood ne!
I authorized the abandoning of your new baby city which popped up during their op since it provided a tactical disadvantage, not the abandoning of your already established city: )

If unclear please consult: )

I am not a defense leader,Sam4892 is,but as a leader in her absence took the decision.

Regards,HH.

(This message was forwarded)
ErikWijmeersch on 2016-05-03 at 18:59
xxxx

(This message was forwarded)
ErikWijmeersch on 2016-05-03 at 18:59
i thought we fought well for that 1 and we earned a lot deff bp lol, sorry after 1000 mails i dont remember this case, next time please just post... different times diffent wars.
Quetzalea on 2016-05-03 at 16:20
last time, one of the defence leaders or council told me that i could lose war for alliance by requesting support in a far city and that i was on my own. do you remember? i ask for support and i was only sent like 900 biremes, so i did not want to bother anyone.
ErikWijmeersch on 2016-05-03 at 09:20
I see you lost a city without notice, please explain?



It shows as read but no reply.
if you were so much affected why you failed to reply and ask for more reasoning?
It shows to everyone with hard incontestable facts what a childish mind you have:)
For a 1k point city that you colonized on your own in the middle of the reds you sold your spirit:)
Enough said:D
 
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Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
Just found an interesting mail dear baby spy:D

Quetzalea
Hell House on 2016-05-03 at 21:09
Mate,you have completely misunderstood ne!
I authorized the abandoning of your new baby city which popped up during their op since it provided a tactical disadvantage, not the abandoning of your already established city: )

If unclear please consult: )

I am not a defense leader,Sam4892 is,but as a leader in her absence took the decision.

Regards,HH.

(This message was forwarded)
ErikWijmeersch on 2016-05-03 at 18:59
xxxx

(This message was forwarded)
ErikWijmeersch on 2016-05-03 at 18:59
i thought we fought well for that 1 and we earned a lot deff bp lol, sorry after 1000 mails i dont remember this case, next time please just post... different times diffent wars.
Quetzalea on 2016-05-03 at 16:20
last time, one of the defence leaders or council told me that i could lose war for alliance by requesting support in a far city and that i was on my own. do you remember? i ask for support and i was only sent like 900 biremes, so i did not want to bother anyone.
ErikWijmeersch on 2016-05-03 at 09:20
I see you lost a city without notice, please explain?



It shows as read but no reply.
if you were so much affected why you failed to reply and ask for more reasoning?
It shows to everyone with hard incontestable facts what a childish mind you have:)
For a 1k point city that you colonized on your own in the middle of the reds you sold your spirit:)
Enough said:D
Let me reiterate it one more time for you. It is mainly not an issue of strategy. It is the way YOU and some others treat people.
It is your inter-personal skills and your ability to recognize that others might have a different perspective. If you treat people with dignity and respect; they will treat you well and be loyal to you. Treat them badly and they will teach you a lesson. It was not the city the issue; it is your arrogance and lack of humanity the problem.

I came clean on my own also because I do not think that is right that the moderators get the blame for it. I really do not know if the other side used the information that I was sending, but I also was monitoring your mood. In my opinion, I sensed that you were panicking and experiencing exhaustion; so I told them to push hard.

In my view, I thought that were ready to throw the towel and then came up with an excuse to ghost because you could not handle the mounting pressure. This is my view, perhaps reality was different, but I am telling my perspective so others know.
 

Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
and yes. I know that I am dead man walking and it is just a matter of time for you guys to annihilate me. No problem. I know that I did the right thing to the game. I prevented you from winning and clarify the issue so moderators are not wrongly blamed. As I said, there were others passing information. You just could not catch anyone. Yes you suspected of everyone, but you did not know.
 

Tea city

Guest
yes,yes:D
we all understood your last mission:D
I am inhuman,I was exhausted:D
That was actually the only mail between me and you,or perhaps the second,and you immediately understood:D
What else instructed Tim to write?:D
 

Athena90

Phrourach
so Quetzalea is proud to betrayed 160 players, sending infos to enemies...just because he had issues with a couple of Leaders.
And he posted here for ?
 

Ev1lK1ng

Phrourach
what i can not understand is why are tea and ranga commenting this but musket or bee members are not?
i think i rest my cease saying that they are also proud of using spies but proud enough to state it on their profile page from the start of the world.

what i would like to know is which leader from bees did get all the info from you Que?
 

herefordgrl

Phrourach
and yes. I know that I am dead man walking and it is just a matter of time for you guys to annihilate me. No problem. I know that I did the right thing to the game. I prevented you from winning and clarify the issue so moderators are not wrongly blamed. As I said, there were others passing information. You just could not catch anyone. Yes you suspected of everyone, but you did not know.
You prevented NB/NSL from winning? That's laughable, at best.

what i can not understand is why are tea and ranga commenting this but musket or bee members are not?
i think i rest my cease saying that they are also proud of using spies but proud enough to state it on their profile page from the start of the world.

what i would like to know is which leader from bees did get all the info from you Que?
Evil, I hadn't commented until your post for one simple reason...Quetzalea hasn't a clue what was going on, nor what we were doing or our strategy. For him to 'take credit' for Bees or Muskies strategy is completely laughable. I can't recall one time that we made a decision because of what "Tim's source" had shared...not once. Sorry to disappoint you Quetzalea, but you didn't provide the "pivot point" of change that you would like to think that you did.

And Nisa
...this player didn't even tell us about Maxi's ban. And since everyone claims that the rest were "strategically planned bans" by our former partners...I can't see why we needed Quetzalea's information, if that was the case.

I am curious about one comment though that you made
- this "fake email" by Karlo, etc that you referenced in an earlier post in this thread. And Tim knowing about it? Can you elaborate or prove please?
 

Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
You prevented NB/NSL from winning? That's laughable, at best.



Evil, I hadn't commented until your post for one simple reason...Quetzalea hasn't a clue what was going on, nor what we were doing or our strategy. For him to 'take credit' for Bees or Muskies strategy is completely laughable. I can't recall one time that we made a decision because of what "Tim's source" had shared...not once. Sorry to disappoint you Quetzalea, but you didn't provide the "pivot point" of change that you would like to think that you did.

And Nisa
...this player didn't even tell us about Maxi's ban. And since everyone claims that the rest were "strategically planned bans" by our former partners...I can't see why we needed Quetzalea's information, if that was the case.

I am curious about one comment though that you made
- this "fake email" by Karlo, etc that you referenced in an earlier post in this thread. And Tim knowing about it? Can you elaborate or prove please?
Thank you for your comments. Let me reiterate this:

1) The task of a spy is to pass information as requested and information that he/she might think is useful. This was my role, and I performed it the best that I could.

2) I do not want to take credit for the good work that your alliances did. I respect it. I never asked about your strategy. I simply passed information.

3) Did the information helped you? Did you win the war faster? We will never know. It is as simple as that. I know that it affected the morale of the NB alliance because I would tend to pass information about targets and it could see that they would not be happy when they were not successful. In addition, it was causing stress knowing that someone was passing information but they could not find who. Again, this is just a perception. We will never know the real impact.

4) I know that the Bees did not like me. This was irrelevant for my decision. I have annoyed them enough. All I can tell you is that the second city in your territory was lost on purpose (I discussed it) and that the first city was won by you guys because someone decided to pull the support just a few minutes the CS was landing. Otherwise, those cities would not have been lost.

5) I have no idea if the other people passing information passed other details or to whom. We will never know.

6) I really think that it is a shock to most of the Bees or Muskts to know that people were feeding them information. I truly think that most people in their allience did not know this. Perhaps I am wrong. I understand that people will take this differently.

The point of the post was just to provide a piece of the puzzle.

I am happy with the decision. I can live with it. If I have do it again, I do it.
Just to let you know the end plan was to get into one of the WW islands and then pull the city at the last moment. It never happened, but that was the ultimate goal.
 

herefordgrl

Phrourach
I do understand your point.

What do you think the likelihood was that Nisa or Erik were going to let you onto one of their WW islands? Your best bet would have been to ask for a breaker position...but I suspect that they already had that all worked out, prior to the changes of relationships with their Northern borders.

In my mind what "changed the game" for NSL/NB was a combination of all major alliances on the server simply deciding that they had enough of the game style and arrogance...add to that the "scheduled bans" that Nisa speaks of and a simple lack of LTS planning (confirmed by players)...and there you have it.

What made the "change" in the game that Muskies (in particular) and Bees experienced a few things:

1. NB/NSL decided to hit Muskies primarily, and early on the dissolution of the NAP that they had (this was actually "pre-coalition")

2. We brought in a player to "unify" the groups against NB/NSL (NOT for the purpose of building WW, bear in mind) since the leadership of the 3 alliances simply couldn't get along - largely due to ego issues and ethics it seems, in retrospect.

3. Effective defensive strategy and LTS planning by certain member/def leaders of the Muskies and Bees groups...and to some extend, Bloods participated in this "side project" as well.

Quetzalea, none of those were related to any of the information that you conveyed to the leaders. I do appreciate your honesty, and I think that more people were made aware of your existence than you realize- there was a lot of discussion about the removal of your second city and whether or not you should be allowed to stay in 55. Frankly- I wanted you gone. As did most of the major players over here in Bees, and they did NOT appreciate being asked to "let you live" or to back off of your city. It left a bad taste in their mouths...we (the original Bees) do not use spies, and we don't approve of "letting them live" in our "hive".

Will the game change again? I would say so...there's a lot of 'play time' left in Golgi...and there are still a lot of "egos" that are left here too, all you have to do is look around a bit. I doubt it would take very long for those "personal agendas" to resurface, fights over who gets to build WW and under which banner they will be held, etc.
 
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Quetzalea

Hekatontarch
Thank you for the reply. I think that I understand and are aware of what you are saying. Wars and armed conflict are mainly abou resources, and tactical organization. The role that spionage plays on those will always be undetermined, as in real life. Perhaps it is more psychological. We will never know.

As for the wonders, this is not the first time that I play with Eviction Notice members. I often manage myself to be under their banner or alliances under different names. Often (not always) I find myself in at leas one of their wonde islands (I know how to do this) With patience it happens. I can almost assure you that I will be in their team again (if it resurfaces) and they will not suspect it. I will probably will play with many of you.

It is fun to come into the worlds with new accounts. Until the next world guys.

This is the first time that I post here because people were attacking the moderators and the game. I wanted to some degree protect a game that I love.