Grepolympia...is too much

[DeletedUser11965]

So..does that mean im a noob? Dx

 

[DeletedUser]

Dude if you give a player everything UNLIMITED he will screw up... Do you disagree? I see players taking troops in farming villages instead resources, i see players sending unescorted TRANSPORTS after 2 MONTHS of server world open!

If you give them unlimited amount of res ill still own them with limited amount of res and only advisors...

here is the key...

Many players who really use gold alot are ACTUALLY also pretty good if not great players, and that is deadly combination...

A noob is a noob regardless of amount of gold he has and will fail in this game against good players. However great player with tons of gold will own everything which is good and useful cos now atleast we can break through tons of MRAs on our world...

Yea, I agree with that, i never said I didn't.. but it's the same stuff you came up with earlier and it's completely besides the point.
I sympathise with what you're saying, keep on bashing those people joining MRAs for protection because they only care about their own city.

The point though, is that the 5k wood, 5k stone and 5k silver is just too much.

The phoenician merchant got changed a while back, because of the people summoning it over and over again for gold trick. With that one, you'd spend 50 gold to get a random good trade.
With the grepolympics, you spend 50 gold to get 70 laurels minimum, and 50 laurels give 5k instant resources of whatever type you'd like. it's like a better version of the same thing that got changed because it was abused..

Also, hi ArShark thanks for opening this thread, it's a shame our DM/EG war will be decided by whoever spends the most now.

 

[DeletedUser29371]

Instead of jumping in the band wagon with a lot of these comments, just take a second to step back and look at the large picture.

1) When you could use the trader as much as you liked, he was only every used when a world first opened. You never saw anyone using it over and over once the world was up and running, their was no need. - So far anyone that is arguing about this if you are not on en44/45 then this will make no difference to you so why bother?

2) How many people farm all day? Have any of you bothered to do the math and work out how many resources you get if you farm 5 minutes over and over to the max?



3) For players that are in the world wonder stage, go do the math above and realise that this again wont make much difference.

4) The only one place this will make a difference, is for players that cant be bothered to farm every 5 minutes, on the newer worlds en44, and en45 as these worlds are new and 5000 resource make a difference early on.


All in all this does not unbalance the game at all, you just have to stand back and think about it for a second then do some math.

Thanks for this thorough example and maths things... now everyone sees they can farm just as much or more than those gold users, they are just lazy or dont have time and complain....

This quote above is also perfect reply to Smeltman and all others thinking this is too much.

 

[DeletedUser11965]

The average person farm 30k-50k per city every day.

 

[DeletedUser]

What is your data for making this claim, how big whats your sample size and how developed was the world/s?

@saska

It's nice that this thing doesn't unbalance worlds where people have 15 cities.

Troy (where ArShark and me are playing) is en.44.
To give an idea, I'm ranked 89 atm, I have 2 cities with about 4k points. 7 farms each, world speed 2. 7 farms give about 200 res for each 5 minutes (bit less in reality), times 2 = 400 res/5 min.
per hour that's 400 * 12 = 4800 res, let us say 5k an hour. Let's also assume that this player is very active and able to farm every 5 minutes for 8 hours (your example uses people that are online and never miss a 5 minute timing for 17 hours a day), that's 40k total resources.
Add in some lootings and some long time farms when you're off, let's make it 50k a day. 500 gold gives 70k of whatever resource you need, instanly, to the right city.
600 gold costs 5 euros and gives more than a top 100 player's farming income on a hugely active day.

So a player spending 50 euros (that's not even a big spender) gets 12000 gold, that converts to 16800 laurels or 16800/50 (need 50 laurels for shop spell)* 5000 (gain 5k res on the shop spells) =1.680.000 resources.

In a world where most of the players are still racing for conquest, that's huge.

I'll give an example of someone using gold and getting huge in troy
http://www.grepostats.com/world/en44/player/1577821/history
one day one 4k city with no bp, ranked about #200. The next day, 3 cities, by now he has 11k points on his main, another one at 8k and a third at 4k, ranked #6. You can even ignore the new cities and just look at his main growin from 4k to 11k in one day

 

[DeletedUser15240]

Good point made by Saska. Unless you are on the two newest worlds, the amount of advantage here is so minimal, unless your willing to spend crazy amounts of gold, that no one would do constantly

You say its unlimited resources. If you have 20 full cities, its 5x5000 to fill up 1 resources warehouse, multiply by 3, You need to buy the resources 15 times. Now multiply that by 20=300. Thats the amount of resource options you would have to buy in order to refill all your cities. Now imagine you do that several times a day. Its 50 laurels per 5000 resource. Now think, how much gold would you have to spend to keep that going, even just for a day. No one is going to spend that much money considering this goes on for a month.

Just a bit of basic maths

 

[DeletedUser]

Good point made by Saska. Unless you are on the two newest worlds, the amount of advantage here is so minimal, unless your willing to spend crazy amounts of gold, that no one would do constantly

You say its unlimited resources. If you have 20 full cities, its 5x5000 to fill up 1 resources warehouse, multiply by 3, You need to buy the resources 15 times. Now multiply that by 20=300. Thats the amount of resource options you would have to buy in order to refill all your cities. Now imagine you do that several times a day. Its 50 laurels per 5000 resource. Now think, how much gold would you have to spend to keep that going, even just for a day. No one is going to spend that much money considering this goes on for a month.

Just a bit of basic maths

yeah great, then change it for the newer worlds or something, that's where the complaining comes from.
ArShark and me don't know each other and are even at war with eachother (#2 alliance vs #3 alliance in case some more people come in to call us noobs)
Or disprove my 'basic math' in the prev post. 50 euros is more than 2 weeks of a top 100 player farming 8 hours a day for 14 days straight for us.

 

[DeletedUser11965]

More like a guesstimates assumption. I know I have nothing to back it up.
Let's assume most people play grepolis for 8 hours to 12 hours a day (dont believe me? Let's set up a poll)
They can get a good run on each FV and assuming they even go pillaging for loots this number seems most decent on a world that's speed 2.

 

[DeletedUser29371]

Your points are referencing 2 players, yourself and someone else that got some cities, let’s be realistic there getting on for 30,000 players on that world your sample size is so small it makes no point whatsoever, if you think this is totally unbalancing the game you need a sample size a lot larger than 2; one person using a large amount of gold does not change the balance of the game. In case you are not aware the game is a team game it’s about what a team do not one player, the game is also limited by culture points, if the 5000 resources was replaced by a city slot for the same price I would agree with you, however it isn’t.

But then again the idea is gold it gives you an advantage; I am not disputing that this is an advantage however it’s a relatively small one, why shouldn’t players that pay to play get more than the guys that play for free?

Every feature that is release in the game changes the balance very slightly in some way, the key is how much of a difference it makes. This makes hardly any difference.

You also appear to have a very warped view of what people spend on the game; you say 50 euros is not a big spender? You categorically have no clue what you are talking about and just making a random guess to scare people in to backing you up. Yes we do get the odd person spending a touch more than that, but really on a server with 40,000 people you’re looking at single figures, nothing like you are trying to make out.

Realisably you should be complain about the merchant more than this that gives you 30% more resource day in day out in the long term that would have a greater impact on the world.

But all in all, a great debate but the side arguing against it have shown no real substance in the argument as of yet, but then again the balance belongs to IG and that have the right to change it if they like.

While i generally agree with you more than with them against it id like to point out that merchant =/= this event and is out of comparison...

Merchant costs 200 gold per month.... thats not even 1 hamburger to have less or 1 beer to put away for merchant...

The point is i can agree that those 2 newer worlds (and then one opening on 31st of july) are having potential problems cos if 1 alliance (15 players) decide to bunch together and spend 24k gold in the next 3-4 weeks they will have pretty good advantage over every other alliance...

But people complaning on worlds that are older than 1 month are not reasonable and only complain cos they are receiving some spanking from those that they annoyed before. Now they do not like it.

 

[DeletedUser11965]

Saska; this was never possible until now.
Watch someone get conquest 24 hours within Zakros' opening.
Then watch someone in Zakros conquer 4-5 cities after BP ends.

 

[DeletedUser]

Saska; this was never possible until now.
Watch someone get conquest 24 hours within Zakros' opening.
Then watch someone in Zakros conquer 4-5 cities after BP ends.

no, no, we are clearly noobs seeing things wrong.

those people doing that in zakros are just so good, this would barely speed them up at all.
0.000x% complain about this, therefore we are wrong. clearly all the people who matter (people with special colors and rights who can't critisize their boss, people abusing this system, and people who don't care because it doesn't affect them) disagree.

let's disregard the fact that people can build up from #500 to top 5 in our world in one day, and ruin everyone's gameplay in the proces.
We're only 2 people out of 30000, surely the 28k inactives would speak against this if they disagreed. they probably make 50k a day from farms or more, proving us wrong

(let's put up a thread called 'deleting grepolis' in this forums. if 50% of all the accounts in all worlds disagree, the game stays alive, if not, it get's deleted. it wouldn't get > 20% replies.)

 

[DeletedUser]

What are you on about?

 

[DeletedUser4013]

While this 'advantage' works in favor of someone wanting to 'win' on a newer world, you first need to have a warehouse that can hold the 5000 resources first. Otherwise the remaining resources are wasted, and so is that gold. In order to actually make full use of those resources you need a Level 10 or Level 9 with Ceramics researched. Either way, it'll be a bit of time before the resources can be used to their full potential in-game.

 

[DeletedUser14937]

I'm not getting involved in the debate but that's not necessarily true. The resources won't be used to their full potential until a certain level of warehouse but whats stopping the spender from using the 5k resources to constantly have a full warehouse, cut down on warehouse build times till they have reached a sufficient warehouse level to hold the 5k resources and just carry on from there !

It's an obvious waste of money I guess but I'm sure the people who want to "win" won't mind.

 

[DeletedUser]

The point is i can agree that those 2 newer worlds (and then one opening on 31st of july) are having potential problems cos if 1 alliance (15 players) decide to bunch together and spend 24k gold in the next 3-4 weeks they will have pretty good advantage over every other alliance...

But people complaning on worlds that are older than 1 month are not reasonable and only complain cos they are receiving some spanking from those that they annoyed before. Now they do not like it.

The trouble on our world is that we have at least one player (and probably at least one other) in the enemy camp who happily admits to spending 15,000 gold in a day! Quite a bit higher than the 24K in 3-4 weeks that you say. This means that multiple members of our alliance are hit with dozens of destructive spells so our resources and time is spent in rebuilding from the spending spree of others.

There is little skill in spending that sort of real money.

 

[DeletedUser]

Frankly, I am shocked and disappointed by the people defending Grepolympia.

I admired Grepolis for being a strategic game. Before Grepolympia, skill and effort were the most important factors. Now they are not.

Someone mentioned chess earlier. Chess is highly regarded because it's a "thinking" game. Let's imagine that the official rules of chess were changed. What if players could buy as many pieces as they want with real money? Would lots of people still play?

Of course not. Chess would become a laughingstock.

This problem is easily fixed. Just put a limit on the number of re-entries.

I really don't know what else to say.

 

[DeletedUser]

For the record, I'm the player Transient is whining about. Tell me, how can ONE player dominate an alliance of 120? Even with all that gold, 120 players should easily be able to dominate me. You're blaming gold for your defeat? I was owning you before these Olympics even began.

 

[DeletedUser12667]

Actually it adds more to the thinking part if you ask me. Yes it may give the ones willing to spend tons an advantage, but it give those who are not willing or able to spend a fortune an oppurtunity to figure a way to compete. And I have seen non goldies rule a world, even with multiple goldies on the same world. So it can be done as long as you have the ability to out think those with money to spend.

 

[DeletedUser]

For the record, I'm the player Transient is whining about. Tell me, how can ONE player dominate an alliance of 120? Even with all that gold, 120 players should easily be able to dominate me. You're blaming gold for your defeat? I was owning you before these Olympics even began.

It is not you alone versus 120. You and one other are 'leading' the Grepolympic race - I do not know about others as I have not looked down the leader board. Thanks to your own admission we know that you're spending about 15,000 gold in a day so the other would not be far behind. Money, or anything else, does not allow to make the perverse claim that you are "owning" me or any other person.

 

[DeletedUser]

Actually it adds more to the thinking part if you ask me. Yes it may give the ones willing to spend tons an advantage, but it give those who are not willing or able to spend a fortune an oppurtunity to figure a way to compete.

That is not "adding" to the thinking part. That's just giving some players a big advantage. (In fact, a literally insuperable advantage, if they spend enough gold.) The other players always have the "opportunity to think", whether or not Grepolympia is changed.

And I have seen non goldies rule a world, even with multiple goldies on the same world. So it can be done as long as you have the ability to out think those with money to spend.

Yes, that is very possible. Before Grepolympia.

I refer you to my chess analogy. Do you honestly believe that chess would remain "The King of Games" if players could buy pieces? If you do, then I'm afraid we will never bridge our differences.

Sorry if I come across as rude; I mean no offense. I just feel strongly about this issue.