BoW/WoF vs. SWARM

Dave Y

Phrourach
"Sometimes a decision to help your allies without going to war is also a smart choice. All that I see here is that BoW is taking the sour end of the stick"

rather be a stupid warrior than smart P**SY

"Again I debate your so called sphere of influence. Looking at the Map it is clear that 3 of those oceans are sparcely populated and easy to infest by the enemy. The only ocean you have any real type of presence is in O45 and that was acquired from the RoaE fall. WWs, r u nuts, if you are preparing for that then you have seriously misguided your troops and have done a horrible job. You are looking at this all with blinders on. So basically no real growth to speak of through credible wars, okay, understood"

Just as much as you have... Like Alex mentioned allready, you picking off inactives may show on statistics, but is no feat of strenght. So basicly Swarm have no real growth to speak of in terms of taking cities from good active players? gotcha!

"I can see it in all the statistics and strategic placement on the map and BoW does not look good for the long haul. Again, your allies will be your only saving grace, but won't be enough. you can't build a strong core in those rim oceans, why you may ask? Because you will need to waste city slots to colonize like mad."

still a possibility :)

"An inside birdie has told me and much more, that is why I can speak with full honesty that BoW is failing...BIG TIME. You guys already gave up weeks ago."

You are so sadly mistaken it's unbelievable how you can twist words. The new world idea to get more good players in close proximity was way before the swarm war started. Swarm war put the idea on hold for a while, and ppl going inactive in numbers accelerated the reimplimentation. That doesn't meen you are gonna win no fight, just meens a some guys will sit back and play supporters for our allies effords against you.
oh real nice try, you mad bro, got your panties in a bunch....can't be original so had to steal from me and my arguments?

You sir are definitely not either a SW or SP, you think you are and that is worse than both. Is that your only point to argue? Inactives? Every alliance has them and you must deal with them just as every alliance does. And have you even put any thought into why they went inactive?!?!?! Because they were getting their behinds thrashed on and could not handle the pressure, cause I'll tell you what, every player was active until they took a beat down from SWARM and the results will repeat itself. Some ran into VM, some decided just to hang up the towel. Just because you all handled it incorrectly and let your alliance mates get pummeled and only protect your "special" friends doesn't take anything away from what SWARM has done. What it does show is a lack of taking care of your alliance and above all a serious communication problem or non desire to really care for every member of your alliance. In the end you all are turning defensive and it shows in your BP stats...this means you will keep losing cities even at a faster rate as def troops diminish.

Please do colonize, your front line with diminish that much faster.

Sounds like you all coped out to me.
 
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Dave Y

Phrourach
And Dave may I just add to that there is a world outside of grepolis, a world which support your very existence; Real life. Things can happen here, such as new jobs, where you are uncurtain, you'll be able to play the way you have been. Things can also just get really boring at times, when some of the good players leave (with no word) or have to go on vac it gets boring if there are to few left to conduct a lot of attacks. BoW have good players, but as you mention we are spread to far, us wanting to play in closer proximity and us giving up weeks ago are 2 entirelly different stories. I'm the one who broke the news, that we'd be leaving the fight to play a new world, but we decided to stay on and support those who wanna fight... Finally new world have not opened and we are still fighting. BoW have not colapsed and BoW is nowhere near doing so. I find it pathetic of you to say, there is better leadership elsewhere. TPW and Minoans couldn't stomach a real fight and merged. RoE ran out of leaders to carry the load and colapsed quickly, yet here we are, still standing, still fighting despite ppl going inactive, enemies sneaking in to part of our core lands and us being spread. I'd say that speaks higher volumes of Alex charecter to keep going strong despite adversity, than some guys who couldn't stomach a real fight being able to keep morale up while alliance is able to pick off cities en masse from inactives.
and it is such a beautiful world, I love it.....I am a fully educated man (MBA), even spent many years in the Military (E-6 Ranger) and fought 3 of my Nations wars....have a family (wife and kids).....so I do know there is a life outside of Grep, I just choose to enjoy playing the game and making a mochary out of you jokers, lol

I understand circumstances come in between time needed to play this game, but that is a choice every single person makes and must live with. Every single one of us knows going into playing this game that it is a real time game, meaning action can happen 24/7 at anytime...you either deal with it and know you won't be a top ranked player, or you and your alliance can't keep up or what have you; it is the way it is. Some people just have more time and opportunity to play and give to this game, that's all, nothing more and nothing less, but take your lumps and loses with dignity; not argue the obvious and normal environmental factors involved with the game.

The TWP and Minoan merger was done out of a mutual desire to achieve something, not about the war in itself and I fully am behind what leadership inside SWARM does cause they are intelligent and make sound and strategic decisions that have SWARM fully dialed in.

Alex has been handing cities off in prep for leaving and you sir have less time to play from what I have heard. Your network is very weak and the intel coming out of your house is stabbing BoW in the back....the dissent is building and soon BoW will implode....you can take that to the bank.
 
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DaHill

Guest
oh real nice try, you mad bro, got your panties in a bunch....can't be original so had to steal from me and my arguments?

You sir are definitely not either a SW or SP, you think you are and that is worse than both. Is that your only point to argue? Inactives? Every alliance has them and you must deal with them just as every alliance does. And have you even put any thought into why they went inactive?!?!?! Because they were getting their behinds thrashed on and could not handle the pressure, cause I'll tell you what, every player was active until they took a beat down from SWARM and the results will repeat itself. Some ran into VM, some decided just to hang up the towel. Just because you all handled it incorrectly and let your alliance mates get pummeled and only protect your "special" friends doesn't take anything away from what SWARM has done. What it does show is a lack of taking care of your alliance and above all a serious communication problem or non desire to really care for every member of your alliance. In the end you all are turning defensive and it shows in your BP stats...this means you will keep losing cities even at a faster rate as def troops diminish.

Please do colonize, your front line with diminish that much faster.

Sounds like you all coped out to me.
Well that is really pathetic. Adamon hadn't lost a single city, when/before he went inactive. Before the former RoE and SoD players started going inactive we where up or even on city count, not once where we down. I do not have a selected few, I protect, yesterday I sniped 6 Swarm CSs in 4 different players cities. Basicly I've snipped every swarm CS, where owner informed me in time for me to time the snipe. Finally Alex have been handing off cities to get slots free and move near the front, I EXPECTED to have less time and allmost all the best playes in our alliance wanted to come along to new world, which should show ppl here are still solidly behind us.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
if i was a member of your alliance i would have some serious doubts and i bet because of those doubts is why so much intel over you guys is bled into SWARM. Your own men want to help SWARM and that is sad. So tell me where your members feel you are doing what is best for them and trust you. My guess is that it is a very limited few.
 

Bearissimus

Phrourach
Reading all this makes me wonder why some people choose to come unarmed to a battle of wits... I'm no fan of SWARM, but Dave Y is having this argument entirely his own way, his opponents only seem to open their mouths to jam their own feet further in - shooting them first, of course.
 

rockys

Guest
To be honest BoW only argument for this war is we are taking inactives as said before kick them internal them or just plan shut up about them

the leadership in BoW dont seem to have a grasp on what SWARM have been doing we have a STRONG CORE where they cant brake into on this core we push into BoW oceans and formed a STRONG CORE in there ocean so therefore we become stronger in there ocean while they are spread out and not building there core you make us stronger and stronger!!

WW this early on i wouldnt think about forming them isle untill like 2/3 months before as by then we will have control of plenty of oceans to not worry to much about it!!

the way things are going ocean 45 will fall soonish i recon that some players will merge into WoF and try to maintain a fight with them but without BoW i feel WoF will fall apart any players lefted will be forced to flee any way they can get a village spreading them out!!

UR and the SC war will get most of them players meaning that there will be alittle tension with swarm and SC as them players will want revange but the leadership of both allaince will sort that out without a war as SC are a senscable leadership UR will become a target for both in the north map and will soon be desotryed im thinking with SC haveing the majority of that ocean afterwards!

the south will become more intense at the moment its still more a skirmish then a war! and with BoW fallen apart it will leave 45 to be totaly conqoured by SWARM
BoW will come to SWARM leadership and be asking them for a merge or a peace which i would recon gets turned down

a few the bigger more skillfull players might be able to tak there way into SWARM ranks as BoW falls apart but it will be under a ever watchfull eye!

but i personaly give BoW a couple of months before they are truely falling apart they not got to that fresh hold whre they are not gainign points yet thats the tipping point!! when they no longer growing but swarm are and BoW start losing rank points!!

again look at swarm we are fighting 5 in the top 10 so we are out numbered do we look anywhere near braking point not yet! are we gainign on all front yes!

well done to BoW for not fallign apart as quick as ROaE but in fairness ROaE had the fall effect of swarm at the start we targeted them from everywhere BoW is getting about half the alalince if that fighting them!
 

DaHill

Guest
rockys it's easy to say internal them. In Adamon's case, which was the big breaker, he logged every day on skype and he was one of the better players in RoE. In some cases we have asked ppl to pick off those cities, we have constantly told ppl internals where availible. The end of it is though, you know as soon as we do when someone haven't been logging for just one day.

Anyways, info was leaking long before swarm got the upper hand, and I know from different sources that BF have spies in all major alliances, so that is not something unique for BoW. Your argument that Alex or rest of leadership is to blame for that is totally misinformed. As I've said allready the best and most active players here are all solidly behind the leadership and ppl here knows the efford we put in. If ppl choise to give up before the fight have started, go awol without informing us or simply not participate much, there is little anyone in leadership here can do about it.
 

DaHill

Guest
Reading all this makes me wonder why some people choose to come unarmed to a battle of wits... I'm no fan of SWARM, but Dave Y is having this argument entirely his own way, his opponents only seem to open their mouths to jam their own feet further in - shooting them first, of course.
We don't and it's hardly a battle of wits. It's a battle of activity, where swarm have been able to take a lot of cities from those without... We where anything but unarmed in terms of LTS plans, coffe spend hours on those, ppl still need to impliment. We where not unarmed in terms of attacking plans. First week of war we where up and we still do take cities from swarm... There was an overall strategy, a solid one and swarm have not been able to take much from those playing towards it, or those benifitting from team mates doing so.

... I'm not saying swarm doesn't have the upper hand, they do. I'm just saying they got that as a result of being able to take inactives as soon as we knew they where there.
... I'm not saying everyone in BoW is playing to a level I appreciate, I don't think so. If then that's Alex's faulth for not kicking over half an alliance, well?

Buttom line though is Swarm doesn't in any way play "wits", they play numbers compared to those active in taking the fight to them (about 10-15 players). They play greater activity than most the rest in the area; and many of those who are less active than the swarm players just stop logging and swarm knows just as soon as we do, have more ppl ready to take. Simple as that, I can help those who talk with me there, and I do both WoF and BoW equally. I can not help those who just stop logging and I don't wanna go mass kick round, bcs it wouldn't accomplish much.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
rockys it's easy to say internal them. In Adamon's case, which was the big breaker, he logged every day on skype and he was one of the better players in RoE. In some cases we have asked ppl to pick off those cities, we have constantly told ppl internals where availible. The end of it is though, you know as soon as we do when someone haven't been logging for just one day.
SWARM internals all their inactives immediately...it is called policy and a common understanding through good communication that if you can not meet these standards then it is better to cut ties. Everyone has inactives, it is all how organized an alliance is in policing them.

Anyways, info was leaking long before swarm got the upper hand, and I know from different sources that BF have spies in all major alliances, so that is not something unique for BoW.
That is a big OUCH right there.

Your argument that Alex or rest of leadership is to blame for that is totally misinformed. As I've said allready the best and most active players here are all solidly behind the leadership and ppl here knows the efford we put in. If ppl choise to give up before the fight have started, go awol without informing us or simply not participate much, there is little anyone in leadership here can do about it.
When something stinks it usually starts from the top, so who sits at the top for BoW again? I thought so. Leadership can do everything if the players feel that leadership is taking care of them, each and every one of them and not throwing them under the bus....not giving them a solid strategy, direction, leadership, solid communication or even one smidgen of belief BoW leadership know what they are doing and are righting the ship, cause you know what, BoW does not have good leadership. Where is the good decision making? Do your members see you leading by example and following through on a strategy or anything like that at all? From here it looks like a ragged mess. CORE of members, huh?!?!?!? HAHAHAHAHA, how many is that, like 10?
 

Bearissimus

Phrourach
We don't and it's hardly a battle of wits. It's a battle of activity, where swarm have been able to take a lot of cities from those without... We where anything but unarmed in terms of LTS plans, coffe spend hours on those, ppl still need to impliment. We where not unarmed in terms of attacking plans. First week of war we where up and we still do take cities from swarm... There was an overall strategy, a solid one and swarm have not been able to take much from those playing towards it, or those benifitting from team mates doing so.

... I'm not saying swarm doesn't have the upper hand, they do. I'm just saying they got that as a result of being able to take inactives as soon as we knew they where there.
... I'm not saying everyone in BoW is playing to a level I appreciate, I don't think so. If then that's Alex's faulth for not kicking over half an alliance, well?

Buttom line though is Swarm doesn't in any way play "wits", they play numbers compared to those active in taking the fight to them (about 10-15 players). They play greater activity than most the rest in the area; and many of those who are less active than the swarm players just stop logging and swarm knows just as soon as we do, have more ppl ready to take. Simple as that, I can help those who talk with me there, and I do both WoF and BoW equally. I can not help those who just stop logging and I don't wanna go mass kick round, bcs it wouldn't accomplish much.
You've precisely proved my point. It's a battle of wits in these forums, and plenty of people seem singularly ill-equipped to fight such a battle. It never ceases to amaze me how so many people don't realise that they're doing themselves and their alliances so much damage by poor posts in here - they would be much better off saying nothing at all. it damages morale, and leads to inactivity and ultimate defeat, especially if it's an alliance's founder that comes over as completely incoherent and incapable, as is all too often the case.
Dave Y is clearly an intelligent guy, what he says comes over to a more-or-less neutral as a lot more credible than what those have posted against him have been saying. Based on what's been said in here by BoW and WoF leaders, if I were in one of their alliances I would be out of there double quick. Note, what THEY have said, not what Dave Y had said - most people are I think too smart to listen to what their enemy says, but if their own leaders make fools of themselves, time to move on. If your enemy says something in here, only reply if you can prove them wrong, make them look stupid, or make yourself look smart. People will largely ignore propaganda unless you make them think it might be true, which is precisely what has happened here with such poor arguments against Dave Y.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
We don't and it's hardly a battle of wits. It's a battle of activity, where swarm have been able to take a lot of cities from those without... We where anything but unarmed in terms of LTS plans, coffe spend hours on those, ppl still need to impliment. We where not unarmed in terms of attacking plans. First week of war we where up and we still do take cities from swarm... There was an overall strategy, a solid one and swarm have not been able to take much from those playing towards it, or those benifitting from team mates doing so.

... I'm not saying swarm doesn't have the upper hand, they do. I'm just saying they got that as a result of being able to take inactives as soon as we knew they where there.
... I'm not saying everyone in BoW is playing to a level I appreciate, I don't think so. If then that's Alex's faulth for not kicking over half an alliance, well?

Buttom line though is Swarm doesn't in any way play "wits", they play numbers compared to those active in taking the fight to them (about 10-15 players). They play greater activity than most the rest in the area; and many of those who are less active than the swarm players just stop logging and swarm knows just as soon as we do, have more ppl ready to take. Simple as that, I can help those who talk with me there, and I do both WoF and BoW equally. I can not help those who just stop logging and I don't wanna go mass kick round, bcs it wouldn't accomplish much.

do or do not my good sir.......this whole post makes me want to cry. If I was on the BoW bus I would get out now and not let leadership have the chance to throw me to the dogs. I am almost speechless, at first I thought my eyes were deceiving me, but it looks like to me that BoW leadership just admitted that they are losing and cannot recover. Was I right or was I right? Cop out
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
You've precisely proved my point. It's a battle of wits in these forums, and plenty of people seem singularly ill-equipped to fight such a battle. It never ceases to amaze me how so many people don't realise that they're doing themselves and their alliances so much damage by poor posts in here - they would be much better off saying nothing at all. it damages morale, and leads to inactivity and ultimate defeat, especially if it's an alliance's founder that comes over as completely incoherent and incapable, as is all too often the case.
Dave Y is clearly an intelligent guy, what he says comes over to a more-or-less neutral as a lot more credible than what those have posted against him have been saying. Based on what's been said in here by BoW and WoF leaders, if I were in one of their alliances I would be out of there double quick. Note, what THEY have said, not what Dave Y had said - most people are I think too smart to listen to what their enemy says, but if their own leaders make fools of themselves, time to move on. If your enemy says something in here, only reply if you can prove them wrong, make them look stupid, or make yourself look smart. People will largely ignore propaganda unless you make them think it might be true, which is precisely what has happened here with such poor arguments against Dave Y.
Absolutely correct. One of the more spot on comments I have read in this forum. Kudos good man, you get a golden star(+rep) from me.

btw, how is UR doing?
 

DaHill

Guest
do or do not my good sir.......this whole post makes me want to cry. If I was on the BoW bus I would get out now and not let leadership have the chance to throw me to the dogs. I am almost speechless, at first I thought my eyes were deceiving me, but it looks like to me that BoW leadership just admitted that they are losing and cannot recover. Was I right or was I right? Cop out
Have thrown noone to the dogs. If you play in Swarm, you know as well as any, I do protect my team mates (WoF included) to the max of my capabilities.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
Have thrown noone to the dogs. If you play in Swarm, you know as well as any, I do protect my team mates (WoF included) to the max of my capabilities.
no, no you don't. No need to lie now. You protect only those players you hold close and call a "friend", that was obvious every time SWARM goes for a city of BoW to see who gets "BIG" Dahill's attention and it sure is not every single member. I bet I could go around and talk to each member of BoW and at least 60% will be unhappy, uninformed and generally unsupportive of BoW leadership. The dissention is just ooozing out of BoW's ranks and my guess is that all those you took in will fall off sooner rather than later. With all the internal structural and organizational problems you all have, and Summer now in full swing, activity will take another hit and you can bet SWARM will do just what its name suggests.
 

Bearissimus

Phrourach
Absolutely correct. One of the more spot on comments I have read in this forum. Kudos good man, you get a golden star(+rep) from me.


Thank you kindly. :)

btw, how is UR doing?
Not brilliantly, but WoF have probably been the saviour of the alliance with their treachery - they've brought us together and given us a common purpose, whereas before too many of us were nowhere near enough to fight SWARM, or even SJC for that matter; unless on the front line, it's been really dull. Now we have an enemy in our midst, and blessing of blessings, a singularly ill-led enemy whose clumsy propaganda attempts.... well, let's just say they're no better in-game than in the externals, and have had pretty much the opposite effect to that desired. Biggest question our leadership has to face at the moment is why they ever let WoF in among us in the first place, but I'll be charitable and suggest it's because they knew we would lack targets. ;) So I think what is emerging is a re-energised alliance looking to kick some bottom, starting with WoF. Must say it came at a good time for me, I was just about to give up on this server as too boring.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
now if SJC would get back to fighting WoF then things would get real interesting. When did you all go back to war with WoF?
 

DaHill

Guest
no, no you don't. No need to lie now. You protect only those players you hold close and call a "friend", that was obvious every time SWARM goes for a city of BoW to see who gets "BIG" Dahill's attention and it sure is not every single member. I bet I could go around and talk to each member of BoW and at least 60% will be unhappy, uninformed and generally unsupportive of BoW leadership. The dissention is just ooozing out of BoW's ranks and my guess is that all those you took in will fall off sooner rather than later. With all the internal structural and organizational problems you all have, and Summer now in full swing, activity will take another hit and you can bet SWARM will do just what its name suggests.
I do not lie. I send LTS and more than my fair qouta, not to those closest, but to those who've asked. I snipe in cities mostly of those closest, correct. Here's the newsflash, they are closest, bcs they ask for my help when needed. They don't "get big hill's attention", bcs they are closest, bcs they are friends. They are friends, they are closest, bcs they atually consistently ask for my help when they need it. If anyone else asks, I'm just as willing to help them.
 

Dave Y

Phrourach
I do not lie. I send LTS and more than my fair qouta, not to those closest, but to those who've asked. I snipe in cities mostly of those closest, correct. Here's the newsflash, they are closest, bcs they ask for my help when needed. They don't "get big hill's attention", bcs they are closest, bcs they are friends. They are friends, they are closest, bcs they atually consistently ask for my help when they need it. If anyone else asks, I'm just as willing to help them.
i would guess some beg to differ. relax bro, no need to get all huffy and puffy...so much anger, so defensive; i must really be pushing your buttons!!! I love it. So you're saying players of yours do not get attention from you because they are friends or are closer; and you said your entire alliance are your friends, so all your friends do not get help from you? That would mean not all your players get your help. You said it, not me. You cannot win the war alone dude, you may win a battle here and there, but not the war. After last count I saw was SWARM 56:15 BoW+WoF. I just don't see why you even come on here and try to debate anything at all. You have already admitted BoW are losing and won't win and that BoW is crumbling. I guess it is all just a matter of time before others jump of the train while it is still running off the tracks. No worries though, SWARM and others will be their to pick up the pieces. You know what would even be smarter for your players, to break of and run their own alliance and try their luck with Diplomacy cause you all have failed. Brought them into a situation they can't win and you all know it. Struggling to pick up pieces and put them together in order to make your alliance seem like everything is okay...i bet those forums are dead inside BoW.....what's that....yep i hear that too...silence....now go run away and hide good sir...just don't, don't try it and don't say anything because you will just make it all worse with some unsnappy comment that makes no sense and basically is complete babble or regurgitated barf you all have already spit out inside this forum......blah :eek::pro:
 

DaHill

Guest
You've precisely proved my point. It's a battle of wits in these forums, and plenty of people seem singularly ill-equipped to fight such a battle. It never ceases to amaze me how so many people don't realise that they're doing themselves and their alliances so much damage by poor posts in here - they would be much better off saying nothing at all. it damages morale, and leads to inactivity and ultimate defeat, especially if it's an alliance's founder that comes over as completely incoherent and incapable, as is all too often the case.
Dave Y is clearly an intelligent guy, what he says comes over to a more-or-less neutral as a lot more credible than what those have posted against him have been saying. Based on what's been said in here by BoW and WoF leaders, if I were in one of their alliances I would be out of there double quick. Note, what THEY have said, not what Dave Y had said - most people are I think too smart to listen to what their enemy says, but if their own leaders make fools of themselves, time to move on. If your enemy says something in here, only reply if you can prove them wrong, make them look stupid, or make yourself look smart. People will largely ignore propaganda unless you make them think it might be true, which is precisely what has happened here with such poor arguments against Dave Y.
Right, I feel your post deserves an honest reply...

I'm not a leader/diplomat, I'm a strategist and a player, that's it. I've been forced to do more, I do not know what is smart to say allways and what is not, I know numbers and patterns. I do know however, what is the truth, and Alex have not made any lies here unlike one curtain Swarm player who throws out wild accusations. You may think, what he have said is wiser, you may be right. I wouldn't know that, all I know is the truth here, and Alex have spoken that.

Where I came from, I wouldn't need diplomacy, I wouldn't need to much in terms of hands on leadership. I had my small kick team, which could beat anybody and all played to an overall strategy that was it. The first time round, I tried to lead a big alliance, they turned on me for being a dictator and I stopped playing Grepo for a long, long time. I came to Mochlos, introduced myself as a newbee after 3 days in serinity, I was thrust in to counsil; in RoE I was voted in to a leadership role, when I didn't wanna actually lead I was pushed back in, bcs it was needed. When I joined BoW all I wanted to do was to form a small group within the alliance to secure footholds in central/west 45. I was "forced" in to high command, bcs it was needed... I never was a big leader or a good diplomat. I never know allways what is the right or the wrong thing to say; here's what I am and what I know.

I speak the truth and I play fair.
I know strategies and I know the truth.
If that breaks morale, if being truthfull is wrong, then I'm simply not cut out to lead big alliances. I will not evaluate if you are right or wrong in your statement about Alex previous comments. Maybe what I post now fall in the same catagory "stupid"? But non the less, I'm just an honest guy playing and sicking up for someone speaking truthfully.

I will rather be a stupid warrior than a wise P**SY I said above.
I would rather be a moranic honest person than a wise lier.