Spam Attacking - Let us begin the conversation here

FutbolTango

Banned
Banned
Ps. by the way...I have to give kudos to those guys for thinking outside the box....it takes certain creativity to push the boundaries of anything....whoever they are...you have to admire their unusual thinking....
 

OldDragon

Phrourach
I thought that a different viewpoint might be refreshing. The following was posted by a Player's Council member, gorsh.daddy, on the US server on Monday:


Spamming is unfortunately the bane of this game’s existence right now. You are not wrong about that.
Obviously, there are many ways to end it (i.e. Create a limit of how many times a player can attack a certain city in a day; make the population ratio larger so someone can't just send one troop out at a time to a certain city; etc...)

Plenty of ways to do it, but with those things I just listed, limits the way people play. Timing in attacks does require multiple recalls and resends, therefore causing pings. Limit that amount on a city, and one of the more fun aspects of the game (getting an awesome time from multiple tries) gets ruined. Same thing with a stacked city: It might need hundreds of attacks in order to clear it out finally, and those attacks may be started a whole day in advance.

Only thing that I see being a reasonable option is limiting the number of attacks and supports a player may have inbound to them at one time. As of now, you can send thousands of attack and supports at a players’ city and cause their screen to lag up, or not even be able to log in. Fixing that could bring players back into the game.

Now, INNO has heard out these ideas, and the cons outweigh the pros. The major aspects that make up the game would be very limited unless some radical change is made to the game, and that radical change could make veterans leave: Unfortunately, right now, more than half of the grepolis servers are veteran players, or friends or family of those veteran players.

For now, people who don't want to be spammed and need a good night's rest, should stay and play in Night Bonus worlds and morale worlds.

Quality of life: Same thing. This is a game, and it is competitive. If someone cannot handle the anxiety that their city might be under siege or attacked, probably shouldn’t be playing this game or should be playing in the Night Bonus and morale worlds to add a cushion.

If someone does not like the idea of losing cities at all because they feel it is unfair when they are offline and cannot get online to protect that city… should play Hyperborea, or the other worlds where only Founding is allowed.



This has been an interesting and revealing thread so far... please try to keep the discussion polite and not talk past each other.
 

zchesney

Chiliarch
It can be annoying when you litterely cant do anything because people are walking around with devices that can alearted at any time and can log in at any time at a moments notice.

Tribal wars does not use this feature to my knowledge and it keeps the game unpredictable if i find out you have alarms and i can spam your alarm so the alarm is dropped so i can actually do something strategically I will. I might aswell message the player im going to attack before hand.

It be better to remove the feature and everyone be on a fair playing feild rather than players who have a advantage complaining their advantage over players who dont have the alarm is being tainted.

I am a good player and i left this game because of the alarm feature a few years back there are two sides to this situation I get both points of this debate but neither side can be pleased fully with the upsides and downsides of this feature.
 

zchesney

Chiliarch
You can solve the spamming very easily and without limiting the game....make it a punishable offence where once a player reports you for spamming then you get a attackable ban.
whats considered spamming ? what if i mess up 10 attacks in a row and have to recall so i get the perfect timings and ratio you cannot determine players intentions or read minds thats obsurd thefore a ban might still be valid but still unjustified.

Is there a process of proof ? can i report you and you just get banned because i reported you ? what if i feel like your spamming me with attacks ? i mean 3 in the space of ten minuets ! my alarm is pinging !! becasue i feel like your spamming me is that justfied as a valid reason for your ban ? I mean you cant deny my reality.

And these are the problems inno games probably have already thought of there are too many parameters and making any actions will probably make things complicated. you do have the option to turn the alarm off and it wasnt an orignal feature to the game.
 

AnWePe

Taxiarch
You can solve the spamming very easily and without limiting the game....make it a punishable offence where once a player reports you for spamming then you get a attackable ban.
that sounds not good, because who determines the number were normal atting ends and spam begins? for me its funny if i get 100 or 200 atts, for my brother would be 10 to much for example, the problem is if you have a number of a limit player will go near to that limit and spam and freeze you legally

why?

ok let´s say inno say 20 atts are enough more is spam. So i take 200 players and each send 19 attacks so all players are doing legally and fine, but you have 3800 attack at you, so would that prevent from spaming? Not really^^

the whole main problem is that NO change will not affect the normal game play so the normal players must say its ok that we will get a little bit of limitation which leads to more player stay in game , but the most player say on no thats a bad idea because it will limit my game play and thats is a bad idea because ..... and so on and so on.

I have no problems with spams against me (it makes me just laughing about it^^) but it would be ok that I get a limitation which helps other players, but most of the players don´t think so.^^
 
Subject: Spam Attacking
Definition: Attacking and recalling attacks persistently with the purpose to annoy an enemy and desensitize them to their attack alarm.

This tactic is not in the good spirit of the game and not what I think InnoGames intended the game to be. I would like to start a conversation here to end the tactic. The game has made great players quit because their mobile alarm gets blown up daily. Attacks should be attacks, not pestering due to the alarm. I think changing this would improve the game and prevent abuse of the game mechanics.
==================================================================================

If this is all you got to complain about about a war game then you might want to play something else. Doing a war game like the saying goes all is fair. Buck up mate or move on.

The strategy is to win a city, war is irritating the act of war isn't game compatible some action of members aren't going to be to your liking, the game has changed over time because people don't play it as designed, that is and will always be the real issue playing Grepolis.

Regards,
The "Three-Toe-Mutant"
 

Bag of Nutts

Lochagos
hey guys my team members are constantly getting spammed and there are around 300 of us ready to quit the game due to 1 person with multiple accounts spamming his ban has been lifted and straight away he spams again can you not block his ip address some thing has to be done please
 
hey guys my team members are constantly getting spammed and there are around 300 of us ready to quit the game due to 1 person with multiple accounts spamming his ban has been lifted and straight away he spams again can you not block his ip address some thing has to be done please
The short answer is no they can’t. Right now our mods currently can’t (wont) handle issues even if people admit they’re breaching the rules.
 

ajayspocket

Chiliarch
The short answer is no they can’t. Right now our mods currently can’t (wont) handle issues even if people admit they’re breaching the rules.
1) I would recommend reducing cancellation time to 2 mins
2) Remove all outer oceans (Ocean 99 ,98 etc) .
3) Remove island without farming villages (at least in domination world)
4) I think all good players (in the sense who has played for a long time) can differentiate spam attacks , Well timed OP , HC .

I think the entire grepolis community will agree that the spammer community that prides itself is way poisonous due to the lack of sportsmanship in a war game.

My above suggestions even though has some drawbacks to the normal players , i think all proper players will eventually adjust
Inno can develop a set of rules to spot obvious spam attacks and punish them. Of course there will be few grey areas we might not be able to cure it completely but we can drastically curb it .

The fact that we all acknowledge the problem - is work half done . Remember end game revamp took several years (Still not solved but its better and hopefully gets better by time) . Spam revamp can take some time but all loyal grepo community will stand by it. We just need to start somewhere not ignore it.
 

Jalmundr the Bear

Hipparchus
Hey snowflakes,

Decade long vet here (some of you know me). Came back to just see what's going on (Not actively playing EN). I'd like to give some input here:

1) A LOT of good ideas have been brought up. Good show to those who have done so and the MODs for actively being engaged in conversation, as well as giving full answers. Glad to see the community is coming together again at least...

2) A suggestion I saw about reducing Recall time limits as well as minimum troop to send would be a good start IF the Devs can do it. I think the example was 10 mins, then 8, then 6 then 4 and etc. Currently, the game already has a minimum troop count. So good ideas, but may not be plausible.

3) As for my helpful input to the thread/ideas, here is mine:

Create a morale system regarding it. The Devs/Mods/Inno would have to comprise of a ratio of attacks allowed per city count. So if I have 10 cities, I could (let's say) send up to 100 attacks on a single person. AFTER that (101+) morale kicks in and IF they are real, the morale drops by 10% (or whatever) each attack after that within a 24 hour period (recycles 24 hours every calendar day - So 12am to 12am). This morale "inhibitor" would engage regardless if the world has active morale or not already. If it doesn't naturally, again, it ONLY kicks in after x amount attacks are sent during a specified time. However, if I send 200 attacks to 10 different people (so 20 each), the morale drop won't play a role. However, the other exception to this rule would be that a certain amount of attacks would also have to actually land.

Going back to the first part of my example where I sent 100 hits at 1 person within a 24hr period, at least 25% of those attacks would actually have to land. This could be within the same 24hr timeline, or an even stricter one (like let's say 6 hours). If they don't, the morale drop also comes into affect.

Both parts of this can be combined and I believe currently morale doesn't drop below 30%??? With this system, morale can (and should) drop to 0%. Which means 100% of the spam attackers units will die. No matter what is defending the city (yes, even if the unit's defensive stat is 0 across the board).

Lastly, once the "max" attack quota for a singular person within this 24hr period is met (using my example), or the 25% hasn't been met, the game will throw a pop-up box warning the attacker of the penalty. In which, IF the penalty DOES occur, ALL further attacks WILL land no matter what. There is no recall option at that point. And since the game has a minimum unit count, that can get VERY costly...

I believe this, or something similar, would be a good deterrent for people who love to abuse the attack button (*cough cough Charlie and others*).

If you find any flaws in this, feel free to say so [anyone].

4) As for my criticism of this post, here's my thoughts to it:

Spam will NEVER be eliminated. Ever. THIS.IS.A.WAR.GAME. I pray to God that a bunch of the snowflakes who cry about being spammed (wholly, partially, or even just attacked a lot) never join any military service of any kind for your country. You will never make it. In war, there is no pause. There is no "hey man I'm tired can you stop shooting at me please? I haven't slept in 72 hours". There is no breaks, there is no letting your guard down. There is no "safe space" or places of peace and calmness. This game runs 24/7. Just as life and REAL war does in real life. Spam attacks in real life look like Guerrilla Warfare. You know how that's handled? You bomb them back to the stone age. So how do you do this in game? As someone else suggested, you get your alliance to bomb them with attacks, negative spells, cave drains, and CS launches. Literally remove them from the game and rim them. It's not hard. I've done it PLENTY of times to people who abuse the spam. I spam myself when I did play (far less towards the end of me playing), but always respectably.

But if this was a matter of life and death, respect would go out the window. This is a game, with a "Win" at the end of it. If you're not willing to win, or do whatever it takes to win, then sign off. The frustration and stress of the game will instantly be gone and you'll be much better off anyways. Especially with how the game has turned into a "pay to win" from it's former older days [years ago].

There are people who will WANT to win, and WILL do whatever it takes to do so. Which means, spam YOU. If you're not okay with that, then don't play. It's part of the game. Just as is losing your cities, your units, your resources and favor. It happens. If you cannot get on board with this, then this is not the game for you. Period.
 
Last edited:

ajayspocket

Chiliarch
4) As for my criticism of this post, here's my thoughts to it:

Spam will NEVER be eliminated. Ever. THIS.IS.A.WAR.GAME. I pray to God that a bunch of the snowflakes who cry about being spammed (wholly, partially, or even just attacked a lot) never join any military service of any kind for your country. You will never make it. In war, there is no pause. There is no "hey man I'm tired can you stop shooting at me please? I haven't slept in 72 hours". There is no breaks, there is no letting your guard down. There is no "safe space" or places of peace and calmness. This game runs 24/7. Just as life and REAL war does in real life. Spam attacks in real life look like Guerrilla Warfare. You know how that's handled? You bomb them back to the stone age. So how do you do this in game? As someone else suggested, you get your alliance to bomb them with attacks, negative spells, cave drains, and CS launches. Literally remove them from the game and rim them. It's not hard. I've done it PLENTY of times to people who abuse the spam. I spam myself when I did play (far less towards the end of me playing), but always respectably.

But if this was a matter of life and death, respect would go out the window. This is a game, with a "Win" at the end of it. If you're not willing to win, or do whatever it takes to win, then sign off. The frustration and stress of the game will instantly be gone and you'll be much better off anyways. Especially with how the game has turned into a "pay to win" from it's former older days [years ago].

There are people who will WANT to win, and WILL do whatever it takes to do so. Which means, spam YOU. If you're not okay with that, then don't play. It's part of the game. Just as is losing your cities, your units, your resources and favor. It happens. If you cannot get on board with this, then this is not the game for you. Period.

Agreed its a war . So no one gets to complain about spam .
Its also a game . So we expect sportsmanship.

Do you agree that in a war game you fight in the front lines and not go to the edge of universe ?
hence our recommendation to make the world closer.

Spam attacks in real life look like Guerrilla Warfare. You know how that's handled? You bomb them back to the stone age. So how do you do this in game? As someone else suggested, you get your alliance to bomb them with attacks, negative spells, cave drains, and CS launches. Literally remove them from the game and rim them. It's not hard. I've done it PLENTY of times to people who abuse the spam.
so your suggestion is to send a bunch of spam attacks back as a response with 2 days TT . It will work ofcourse . But i dont intend to be part of the SPAM community . I just want to be part of the playing community that's actively seeking the common goal - win WW or Domination.

Your other recommendations are great by the way . Even if spam isnt eliminated we can curb it and make it less effective. so the playing community can play.


PS: i really wish that this discussion doesnt become a spam thread with nonsensical posts.
 

Jalmundr the Bear

Hipparchus
Agreed its a war . So no one gets to complain about spam .
Its also a game . So we expect sportsmanship.

Do you agree that in a war game you fight in the front lines and not go to the edge of universe ?
hence our recommendation to make the world closer.



so your suggestion is to send a bunch of spam attacks back as a response with 2 days TT . It will work ofcourse . But i dont intend to be part of the SPAM community . I just want to be part of the playing community that's actively seeking the common goal - win WW or Domination.

Your other recommendations are great by the way . Even if spam isnt eliminated we can curb it and make it less effective. so the playing community can play.


PS: i really wish that this discussion doesnt become a spam thread with nonsensical posts.
1) Yes. Those on the "edge of the universe" just in general are cowards. More so if they spam. But what's great is that the system I suggested would force those to land and eventually be utterly pointless to send unless you want an enemy to earn literal free BP. So, IF the Devs & MODs can figure out to get it to work, the "EOTU" people will immediately decline. As will their spam.

2) The worlds are already "closer". People are leaving this game daily. I left a bit back. Only back (not EN) for the summer because at work I literally have nothing to do (I work at a university). I have 0 desire to win either. Just play, grow attack some things, etc. Keep myself from growing insane from boredom really. There's no longer "Core Oceans". We can barely fill them halfway now with new worlds. Fast or slow. So this has already happened. Inno turned this game into a "pay to win". Hence the mass drop of players.

3) Responding to your "So your suggestion is..." -> You have clearly set yourself as someone who will not do whatever it takes to win. Therefore, you don't want to win. Again, this is a war game. It's going to happen. IF your alliance/leaders say "Spam x" as part of an OP, you not going to join? Be prepared to be internalized or booted. Again, if you want to win, you WILL do WHATEVER.IT.TAKES. This game isn't won by "hey guys, I'm trying to win, can you guys make sure that happens and don't attack me or make my life stressful please?" GTHO of here snowflake. I understand you want to win by "fair play", but Spam IS fair play. Always has been. And so long as this game is a war game, it always will be.

You can spam and still be respectful about it. Ask any long time vet, especially us "old world" Vets who were around before heroes, Artemis, events every month or so, before the myth revamp/rebalance, and the current gold system (and trading). Heck, in today's Grepolis, if you trash talk at all, especially on the forums, everyone wants to hang you because they can't handle being told "you suck and your mother does too". The snowflake generation truly has taken over this game and that's why so many REAL fighters have retired. We're actually good, and can handle intense pressure, most people get ticket happy now and report happy then scream insults and obscenities and go to their MOD buddies for bans. "Daddddddd Jalmundr's being mean to me again! He said I suck and he took 5 of my cities in one night. Can you ban him please!?"

Give me a break... :mad::rolleyes:o_O

4) I appreciate that though. But you need to understand that if you're not willing to do whatever it takes to win, you won't.
 

ajayspocket

Chiliarch
This game isn't won by "hey guys, I'm trying to win, can you guys make sure that happens and don't attack me or make my life stressful please?" GTHO of here snowflake. I understand you want to win by "fair play", but Spam IS fair play. Always has been. And so long as this game is a war game, it always will be.
4) I appreciate that though. But you need to understand that if you're not willing to do whatever it takes to win, you won't.
I agree with what you mentioned

If spam is considered legit - I am cool with it . The spammer then shouldnt justify when everyone gangs up on him/her . The Spam & CO basically justify their SPAM as a retaliation for being attacked. My response to all the above threads is just for people who are cowards sitting in the RIM Spamming yet calling themselves as legendary fighters - no one else.

by the way big ol' grand daddy - I ain't a snow flake . "My D*&k is bigger than yours " - see I just managed to offend you and yet stay within the forum rules . Inno's game and Inno's rules if you get banned for profanity in forrum then like you said " Dont Cry"
 

Jalmundr the Bear

Hipparchus
I agree with what you mentioned

If spam is considered legit - I am cool with it . The spammer then shouldnt justify when everyone gangs up on him/her . The Spam & CO basically justify their SPAM as a retaliation for being attacked. My response to all the above threads is just for people who are cowards sitting in the RIM Spamming yet calling themselves as legendary fighters - no one else.

by the way big ol' grand daddy - I ain't a snow flake . "My D*&k is bigger than yours " - see I just managed to offend you and yet stay within the forum rules . Inno's game and Inno's rules if you get banned for profanity in forrum then like you said " Dont Cry"
Lol, I was more speaking to the mentality of "don't attack me/spam me" vs you lol. Idk you (nor you me) in game but I didn't have you pegged as a snowflake. I trash talk a lot and call many people snowflakes haha. Drives everyone up a wall. You should've seen last EN world I played. Myth nukes for days breaking EVERY siege and tore apart 3 alliances because they couldn't grow with me around haha! I like you though, we can be friends. :D

Anyways, I'm on board with you. Rim Spammers are the worst. Best policy I've found is to just ignore them and let them do their thing. If you bat an eye to them, they keep it up. You don't give the the time of day, they go away. Kind of like the bully thing? Idk.

Anyways, I hope the MOD/Devs/INNO are able to look at my first post in Point 3 and game-plan with it. Might be worth something. BTW (MODs/Devs/etc), feel free to give input on it!

Peaceee
 

ajayspocket

Chiliarch
You should've seen last EN world I played. Myth nukes for days breaking EVERY siege and tore apart 3 alliances because they couldn't grow with me around haha! I like you though, we can be friends. :D
Same . Not playing these days due to RL. You might want to edit the previous post , some kids take delight in getting people banned for friendly profanity too.

Lets get back to the topic - Spam Attacks
 

hrdinajr

Lochagos
To see ports one does not send LS attacks to other cities. And if someone does it with that intention, he is saying that he knows little or nothing about the game.

Someone who sends 5,10,20, ... LS attacks from the same city to other cities the only thing that is intended is to bother.

This action is corrected by expelling the player from the world in which he does it.



Not true... I can check on what's in the harbor by my wall report or the amount of BP gained. I checked a harbor once with 20 ls and got bp that indicated an LS nuke sitting there unprotected so I sent in the attacks and cleaned it out. It is an effective way to play the game.
 

=M.V.K.=

Hipparchus
Between raiding for resources and variant attacks, the worth of SPAM Attacks still seems more the question.

Say on a breakdown of look out for looking in, say from, regards to an RTS for the samething, if you sent say 10 Attacks at something, why would it be 10 attacks, and when does an attack just become an attack?

Yea, going against harder computer opponents at a time makes more sense for why the are multi-attacks reasonable to happen to work down say what to attack. But in general would still say otherwise the worth of such is reasonable usually either way.

Especially in regards to an unquestionable wargame aspect of standpoint.

SPAM has a whole new meaning and place of interest.

But still, Outside notifications there isn't much a difference, but knowing of course there is.

So, is it the SPAM really that is the difference or what they are for?
 

Lord Escanor

Hekatontarch
Spam is fine in my opinion, but the problem arises when people use bots and mouse clickers to spam. To prevent people from using bots and mouse clickers to spam is to introduce captchas when attacks are placed. The conditions which must be met for captchas to show up must be thought over and revised, so not to mess up normal game functions.

Secondly, if someone signs in or signs up with a Data Center IP address they must be banned immediately. This is automated on most sites and it's ridiculous that this isn't implemented on grepolis. It's insane how someone could sign up with TOR to play grepolis. There should be a long list of known bad IP addresses that cannot access this game and then there must be a Data Center check on every IP that signs up for this game or signs in. At the moment, this is done manually when someone gets reported enough times, but it needs to be done without human interaction because moderators sleep.

I thought these low point spam accounts on the rim was an EN issue, but it turns out it's happening on other servers even more