Top 12 Sink or Swim+Discussion

Canby

Guest
Pretty darn sure the title at the top says:

World Abdera (en84)
Sure does, although the actions of some EN leaders in that world makes it relevant to this one.
Mainly because their tactics were carbon copy of ENs and the situation is similar to now (EN not having the shipping power to complete all 7 wonders first)

Anyway its hard to brush these events under the carpet when people come on bragging about what their 1/8 of the alliance achieved, especially when the other 700 players involved got stung.
 

skiboot

Phrourach
Pretty darn sure the title at the top says:

World Abdera (en84)
Reminding ourselves of previous behaviour is always useful, especially when it highlights deception, false promises and a total disregard for your team when they are no longer useful to you.
 

jonnybrussell

Guest
Sure does, although the actions of some EN leaders in that world makes it relevant to this one.
Mainly because their tactics were carbon copy of ENs and the situation is similar to now (EN not having the shipping power to complete all 7 wonders first)

Anyway its hard to brush these events under the carpet when people come on bragging about what their 1/8 of the alliance achieved, especially when the other 700 players involved got stung.
i really dont get the en hate to be honest

i played against them (sort of) in nysa

i played with them eventually in sinope

i played with them from the start here


and what have i found on my travels ............. well they arent evil in fact they are a pretty decent set of people - like most alliances

what they are good at is planning, tactics and activity

the anti en brigade moan about en pacts ......then they do exactly the same but refuse to admit it.

and on this server it appears to me that the enemy will stoop to pretty much nothing
to win while trying to take the morale high ground.


There was some pretty nasty stuff directed at me when i said bloods and qoq were pacted - i saw the shared forums - but i was branded a liar ......... qoq and nc tried to shaft bloods - at least en attacked them in a good old fashioned war.

But here we are with qoq still trying to push the evil en line..............

truth is en are a good alliance - and all qoq have achieved is to push more people into the en fold for this server and future servers so perhaps we should thank qoq for their en recruitment ;-)
 

Canby

Guest
i really dont get the en hate to be honest
i played against them (sort of) in nysa
i played with them eventually in sinope
i played with them from the start here

and what have i found on my travels ............. well they arent evil in fact they are a pretty decent set of people - like most alliances

the anti en brigade moan about en pacts ......then they do exactly the same but refuse to admit it.
But here we are with qoq still trying to push the evil en line..............
What makes you think I hate EN?? Evil??? lol
I have friends in EN, played with many others also and played against many. Havent got a bad word to say about the vast majority of them.
Those core EN players that played Sinope who either let their enemy take their wonder cities or dropped out of the alliance to bust the rest however, that is a different matter, especially when they were the alliances founder and leader at the time.

For the record I also think EN is a good alliance, in terms of prepping themselves to be the best res shippers they can be.
Just because their tactics and ideology are not one which I like to play by doesnt mean I cannot respect my opposition. Its just a shame most EN players can only seem to respect the opposition they want to absorb.


when i said bloods and qoq were pacted - i saw the shared forums - but i was branded a liar
What do you expect when you come on and say something thats not true?
 
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You know very well I'm not into that, and it's not that hard to have over half your points in BP. You know that.
I do... all I am saying is...to my mind its far better having about half/less than half ur points in BP... earned from the enemy than manufactured playing with oneself... just asking if u agree

:)
 

Notalot

Guest
What makes you think I hate EN??? Evil?? lol
I have friends in EN, played with many others also and played against many. Havent got a bad word to say about the vast majority of them.
Those that either let their enemy take their wonder cities or drop out of the alliance to bust the rest however, that is a different matter, especially when they are the alliances founder and leader.
I have no founders in my team who have done any of the stuff you suggest above. If you're going to make those sorts of allegations Ash, you might wanna check who the founders actually ARE??
 

Canby

Guest
I have no founders in my team who have done any of the stuff you suggest above. If you're going to make those sorts of allegations Ash, you might wanna check who the founders actually ARE??
No sorry you misunderstood what I put, I meant they were founders/leaders in Sinope. I will edit my post to save any further confusion
 

Praehelios

Guest
What makes you think I hate EN?? Evil??? lol
I have friends in EN, played with many others also and played against many. Havent got a bad word to say about the vast majority of them.
Those that either let their enemy take their wonder cities or drop out of the alliance to bust the rest however, that is a different matter, especially when they are the alliances founder and leader. Which is what happened in Sinope.

For the record I also think EN is a good alliance, in terms prepping themselves to be the best res shippers they can be.
Just because their tactics and ideology are not one which I like to play by doesnt mean I cannot respect my opposition. Its just a shame most EN players can only seem to respect the opposition they want to absorb.




What do you expect when you come on and say something thats not true?
Everyone of your posts has been anti EN, or anti EN player. I've not come across one post in which you praise EN or its players for what they do. Often you lay out a brief compliment, followed by an insult as in this above post. Maybe that's why folks think you "Hate" EN.

I'd also like to point out you were on the side of these EN style tactics in Nysa. Your alliance agreed to help us feed wonders in exchange for crowns. Until Viv, Jolis and others ghosted after getting their crown jipping some of your teammates "The Barbarians" out of those very crowns. How come you have no distaste for her and QoQ? One sided hatred further displays you have a chip on your shoulder when you here the words "Eviction Notice".
 
Everyone of your posts has been anti EN, or anti EN player. I've not come across one post in which you praise EN or its players for what they do. Often you lay out a brief compliment, followed by an insult as in this above post. Maybe that's why folks think you "Hate" EN.

I'd also like to point out you were on the side of these EN style tactics in Nysa. Your alliance agreed to help us feed wonders in exchange for crowns. Until Viv, Jolis and others ghosted after getting their crown jipping some of your teammates "The Barbarians" out of those very crowns. How come you have no distaste for her and QoQ? One sided hatred further displays you have a chip on your shoulder when you here the words "Eviction Notice".
Prae you do realise this is not convenient for them... and all of this is window dressing anyhow to cover the double standards
 
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Canby

Guest
Everyone of your posts has been anti EN, or anti EN player. I've not come across one post in which you praise EN or its players for what they do. Often you lay out a brief compliment, followed by an insult as in this above post. Maybe that's why folks think you "Hate" EN.
No all my posts have not been anti EN or their players, I have some nice convos in game with some of them. The ones I have spoken to seem great.

I'd also like to point out you were on the side of these EN style tactics in Nysa. Your alliance agreed to help us feed wonders in exchange for crowns. Until Viv, Jolis and others ghosted after getting their crown jipping some of your teammates "The Barbarians" out of those very crowns. How come you have no distaste for her and QoQ? One sided hatred further displays you have a chip on your shoulder when you here the words "Eviction Notice".
Wasnt my alliance in Nysa, merely a player for half the server but was fortunate enough to be given leader rights halfway down the line. Personally I wouldnt have pacted with any side in Nysa and just slogged it out but obviously the decision went with what the founders wanted to do.

Me, KungFuChicken and a few others spent WW fighting and busting NDOs wonder islands whilst a few newbies who wanted crowns shipped you res/favour. The crown issue was before anybody ghost, it was simply down to available spaces and that NI wouldnt run through the crowning process more than twice.
 
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jonnybrussell

Guest
What makes you think I hate EN?? Evil??? lol
I have friends in EN, played with many others also and played against many. Havent got a bad word to say about the vast majority of them.
Those core EN players that played Sinope who either let their enemy take their wonder cities or dropped out of the alliance to bust the rest however, that is a different matter, especially when they were the alliances founder and leader at the time.

For the record I also think EN is a good alliance, in terms of prepping themselves to be the best res shippers they can be.
Just because their tactics and ideology are not one which I like to play by doesnt mean I cannot respect my opposition. Its just a shame most EN players can only seem to respect the opposition they want to absorb.




What do you expect when you come on and say something thats not true?

well firstly everything you post is anti en and its 'tactics'

you say you dont like en's philosophy

and yet your alliance is so different?

qoq painted an illusion of being a stand alone alliance, despite pacting with bloods, despite working with NC.......qoq followed the same route as en but they wouldnt admit it......qoq have worked the whole server to be everyone against en - how is that better than en pacting?

we could also discuss qoq burning their own troops to gain bp.... is that better than anything en does?

and lets not forget the botting....and it is obvious from the stats ............so to constantly push that qoq are morally superior is frankly laughable.
 

Canby

Guest
well firstly everything you post is anti en and its 'tactics'

you say you dont like en's philosophy

and yet your alliance is so different?
No its not, what I say is just a preference thing,
Prefering one thing over another doesnt mean you have to be anti the alternative
When we dropped there were only 20 players and everything around was ok to attack and take. When EN dropped they brought 100 players and fairly quickly got pacts with hammer, formed a third wing and then pacted bloods meaning there was alot less to attack and more competition between themselves for bp/cities.

Not saying one is a good/bad way to start servers but they are quite different and of course the outcomes were also as nobody in QoQ was short of farms or were fighting over limited cities at the start so growth was great.

qoq painted an illusion of being a stand alone alliance, despite pacting with bloods, despite working with NC.......qoq followed the same route as en but they wouldnt admit it......qoq have worked the whole server to be everyone against en - how is that better than en pacting?
No never pacted with bloods, ask Martinus if you dont believe it still.


we could also discuss qoq burning their own troops to gain bp.... is that better than anything en does?
Not really much to discuss but I think its a boring way to play the game. No fun in it.


so to constantly push that qoq are morally superior is frankly laughable.
Where do I say QoQ are morally superior? I have talked about my personal opinions on matters and what I would have done in certain situations. I am not the embodiment of QoQ, not even a leader lol
Disagree with me on how you like play grepo, its fine to like different things.
 
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...No never pacted with bloods, ask Martinus if you dont believe it still...
From what little I know this is true.... the word PACT were never used... and we all know without the use of this magic word a pact is never a pact

Nevermind that QOQ were together in bed with Bloods... or as johnny says had a shared Def Forum (am assuming this is correct).... or that QOQ were sending support to revolted Blood cities with alacrity (they did need BPs you see).... but lets be clear there was no PACT... let these minor details no delude the public at large.... and yes ask Martinus if in doubt

....I am not the embodiment of QoQ, not even a leader lol...
Oh matey c'mon...dont sell yourself short... leader or not ....you are EXACTLY the embodiment of QOQ ! like a duck to water....perfectly matched/suited

Also do share what happened to your good friend zarun ?... unless ofcourse it is classified top secret or something
 
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Jolis II

Chiliarch
Everyone of your posts has been anti EN, or anti EN player. I've not come across one post in which you praise EN or its players for what they do. Often you lay out a brief compliment, followed by an insult as in this above post. Maybe that's why folks think you "Hate" EN.

I'd also like to point out you were on the side of these EN style tactics in Nysa. Your alliance agreed to help us feed wonders in exchange for crowns. Until Viv, Jolis and others ghosted after getting their crown jipping some of your teammates "The Barbarians" out of those very crowns. How come you have no distaste for her and QoQ? One sided hatred further displays you have a chip on your shoulder when you here the words "Eviction Notice".
Viv ghosted because Red (who was the founder of Ni in Nysa) turned nasty in the next world and they had WORDS... If I were her I'd have been mightily offended too. You have only Red to thank for that happening. It was also over. World was won. We stuck around for all Ni branches to get crowns. At the time several of us stopped playing there, it wasn't clear what the deal was with the Barbarian players at that time either - so you can't pin that on Viv or myself. Talk to whoever in Ni leadership you had as a liaison. We did our part. As for calling Barbs our teammates.. that is stretching the definition somewhat Prae. A small handful of Barbs sent some res to help wonders. That is all. You were removed by two oceans from ourselves and we neither shared any forums nor chat rooms. I'm not even sure why the deal was offered. Ni had the numbers to win without the extra res I am sure.

When I ghosted I gave the remaining players time to take my cities. So, again, talk to the ones who wanted to play on in a dead world about that. Perhaps they could have gotten in some barbs members them to help absorb all the ghosts? I don't know what went down after that coz I wasn't there. But I am surprised to see that finishing up in a finished world somehow makes me a candidate for distaste.

As for 'EN hating', I have to say a good strong enemy with a good strong reputation is a wonderful thing to have. Take it as a testament to your victories. It's the tall poppy syndrome. The exact same motivating force that makes people want to pick on certain top ranked players from time to time. It is also generally intended in good sport. Those few times one or another of us gets too personal in their insults they are called out and their good nature is rightfully brought into question, and from there stronger dislikes are sometimes formed. I am sure all commentators in the externals are a little guilty of it at times. However, if anyone feels they have been more insulted than QoQ's top members in this server I'd like to see the logic behind it. We have been on the defensive against innumerable accusations and insults from the moment we started to top the rankings and yes, our responses to those accusations and personal insults are sometimes strong. You want a world where no-one insults anyone or hates anyone? Then control your own members and your own mouths and play the game in the spirit we all once enjoyed.


EN have had a good run. Personally I can see why the general impression of outsiders is that EN tries to win by recruitment though. It does seem that EN leadership has lacked confidence in it members and goes for overkill so I'm sure that others see it the same way. You may not like the assessment but it's probably pointless arguing against the irrefutable evidence (ie: sheer numbers in the coalition)
 

OldDragon

Phrourach
Also do share what happened to your good friend zarun ?... unless ofcourse it is classified top secret or something
I stopped playing when the game had clearly become an overly monetized scam. I don't care who wins this world. I have no horse in this race.

However Zaran was a friend once and a decent guy. So I will say a few words on the occasion of his passing. He loved this game ... He wanted to beat EN so bad. That was his Great White Whale. Based on the evidence I would say Zaran ghosted two days ago. So another long time player bites the dust. I am happy for him if this means he has finally kicked his addictive obsession. I feel a bittersweet sorrow for the rest of you. There are so many better things that you could be doing with your short lives. So before anyone makes another snarky comment or starts gloating over this sad little moment... perhaps you should take a look in the mirror and ask yourself who is the real winner?
 

destroxxi

Phrourach
:cool: o.0 lol every world EN is on gets this active forum with arguments :-D anyway popping in saying watsup to the EN peeps prae, prat, kt, and the bastards as for sinope yeah we still won lost in the end but it would of gone on for probably a year or two at the rate it was going so shrug no loss there. Fluffs and Holy wound up getting a crown fair trade all three alliances of that world fought well and they came out because of some real life issues shrug it happens.
 

MartinusV

Strategos
From what little I know this is true.... the word PACT were never used... and we all know without the use of this magic word a pact is never a pact

Nevermind that QOQ were together in bed with Bloods... or as johnny says had a shared Def Forum (am assuming this is correct).... or that QOQ were sending support to revolted Blood cities with alacrity (they did need BPs you see).... but lets be clear there was no PACT... let these minor details no delude the public at large.... and yes ask Martinus if in doubt
Correct - no official NAP/PACT - more of a mutual understanding. I did find strange actually as QOQ were taking our cities at the same rate EN were but most of us were very greatful for the support which was returned. So in actual fact any talk of betrayal on QOQ's behalf could well be questionable as there was no formal NAP/PACT. cool huh lol

hey its all good now though - a nice war to end the server. That is the object of the game isn't it (stupid wonders)
 

Slothbozeman

Strategos
I feel a bittersweet sorrow for the rest of you. There are so many better things that you could be doing with your short lives. So before anyone makes another snarky comment or starts gloating over this sad little moment... perhaps you should take a look in the mirror and ask yourself who is the real winner?
Hm...
 

Praehelios

Guest
I feel a bittersweet sorrow for the rest of you. There are so many better things that you could be doing with your short lives. So before anyone makes another snarky comment or starts gloating over this sad little moment... perhaps you should take a look in the mirror and ask yourself who is the real winner?
I wouldn't say that around these QoQ folk if I were you. They frown upon any one having priorities outside of Grepolis. Trust me!